Here’s something I’ll never understand. Why is it that those of us who are willing to do what it takes to beat Democrats are called “Republicans in name only” or worse? Meanwhile those conservatives willing to accept years of Democratic government rather than adjust any point congratulate themselves on their commitment and dedication. Seems backwards, no? For the moment, of course, it’s the latter group who outnumber the former. But that will change. As sure as anything in politics, that will change, for the reason once brutally explained by Benjamin Franklin: “Experience is a hard teacher, but fools will have no other.”
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Who You Calling a RINO?
November 18th, 2009 at 9:49 am by David Frum | 58 Comments |
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58 responses so far
1 PracticalGirl // Nov 18, 2009 at 11:16 am
RINO is an anagram of convenience and an easy way for some of a certain perspective to instantly raise a flag to their audience or constituency that says “Not one of us”. It is a great way to stop conversation and debate and a great excuse for GOP politicians to wiggle out of ever taking any real, lasting steps to fix the ills of the country.
Who wants to do the hard work when they risk being labeled a RINO in an election year (which is every year, as we all know)? And why should they, when, as a convenient reason for inaction, they can point to a rabid, loud base that can only say “No!”? That may be the job of perspective media, but shouldn’t we expect more from our elected policy makers?
Go all the way back to the immigration reform attempt in ‘06. The GOP had control of every political body necessary to pass reform, but charges of RINO were levied against any politician who dared to admit that the issue was complicated and might take several, simultaneous actions to solve. McCain became “Johnny McAmnesty”, Senator Brownback became “Senator Swichback” (and worse), and they both were labeled RINOs. It was an election year, the base was loud with their warnings, and so instead of beginning the hard work of unwinding some very damaging policies, the GOP DROPPED the issue entirely.
We have serious policy issues in this country, and we need thoughtful leaders on both sides to fix them. We need statesmen and women to do this. And it’s worth noting- often, when the “conservative” base uses labels and anagrams to prevent legislative steps, it’s the causes of the right-not the left- that seem to get left out in the cold.
2 MI-GOPer // Nov 18, 2009 at 11:28 am
David, as a longtime Ripon Republican, I can identify with the heat that being called a RINO can generate for me… especially when it’s done by a couch-loving conservative who stayed at home in the last election and helped elect Obama with their snite-fest, spiteful anti-McCain “he’s not pure enuff” for me non-vote.
They are actually the RINO. Snorting, grunting, pissing in the watering hole. As a teenager, I was on the frontline fighting the first round of conservatives who came into the Party on the glidepath of the Moral Majority… I thought the GOP stars were men like Elliot Richardson and Nelson Rockefeller and Geo Bush 41… not Pat Robertson, Tom Delay, Duke Cunningham.
RINOs, to me, are the guys who stayed home on Election Day 08 and turned over the govt to Obama and his Chicago Thugs. It isn’t Jim Jeffords or Libby Dole or Christy Todd Whitman or Bill Milliken. The real RINOs are the couch-potato conservatives and libertarians who gave us Obama, by default.
If we don’t learn that lesson, the GOP will repeat the mistakes made in 08. The trick is to motivate those real RINOs sufficiently to vote, but not to let them under the tent or sit at the table. And that’s tough to do.
3 Churl // Nov 18, 2009 at 11:29 am
PracticalGirl, “immigration reform” failed precisely because voters realized that it was an amnesty bill whose net effect would be to reward illegal immigrants and set the country up for a bigger wave of illegal immigration.
The Republican establishment wanted it because it would guarantee a permanent stream of cheap labor; the Democrats were all for it because it would forever increase the number of hereditary Democrat voters.
Neither of these arguments impressed the great mass of voters and they let their representatives know it.
4 Churl // Nov 18, 2009 at 11:35 am
MI-GOPer, how many of the folks you call “RINOs” stayed home on election day 2008?
“Elliot Richardson and Nelson Rockefeller and Geo Bush 41″. Two never-made-its and a one term president knocked out of office by an Arkansas slickster.
And you’re bursting with advice about how to win elections?
5 Toddtheconservative // Nov 18, 2009 at 11:38 am
David never give up the fight and just keep it up. The Palin wing of party could never win. Someone needs to beat this president. Read this sad link:
http://americaspeaksink.com/2009/11/race-black-president-bows/
6 MI-GOPer // Nov 18, 2009 at 11:48 am
C Hurl asks: “MI-GOPer, how many of the folks you call “RINOs” stayed home on election day 2008?”
Well, according to election pundits like Karl Rove and Michael Barone, about 7.4m social conservative voters who had voted for Bush 43 on two occasions. And trending that number correctly, puts the soc-con/econ-con vote at about 7.6m on Election Day 08.
Yep, I am not only giving election advice… I’m working to see that those guys I call RINOs -who aren’t the ones that you and the conventional wisdom might call RINOs- are motivated on ‘10 and ‘12 Election Days to get off the couch and vote.
I don’t want them in any GOP state primary vote. I don’t want them sitting at the GOP leadership table. I sure as Hell don’t want them under the tent with the real loyalist GOPers who are really doing the work to rebuild the Party… what I’d like to do is put up a sign like Congressional Maj Leader Tom Delay once had outside his office suite: “No moderates need apply”? I’d like it to read, “Conservatives, we’ll take your vote, we’ll take your money but there’s no way in Hell you’re going to be allowed to destroy the Party for another generation”.
It’s really that simple, C Hurl.
7 MI-GOPer // Nov 18, 2009 at 11:53 am
C Hurl writes: “PracticalGirl, “immigration reform” failed precisely because voters realized that it was an amnesty bill whose net effect would be to reward illegal immigrants and set the country up for a bigger wave of illegal immigration.”
Bull, C Hurl.
Immigration reform lost because Rush and Dobbs and others were able to whip up a racist, bigoted base that thinks they are conservatives in order to profit with more air time, more manufactured outrage, more bigoted base building. It was profit driving policy and appealing to bigots made it work this time.
8 Churl // Nov 18, 2009 at 12:05 pm
MI-GOPer, you have an interesting approach to vote-getting and fund raising. Tell a large number of your most likely supporters “Give us your votes, give us your money and then push off, you bigoted racists.”
Sounds to me like advice that David Axelrod would like the GOP to follow.
9 PracticalGirl // Nov 18, 2009 at 12:07 pm
Churl,
I hear what you’re saying, but the fact remains: This is not an easy problem, and the GOP shied completely away from addressing the necessary steps to do it, even though it was center to the eclection platforms in 2000 and 2004.
“Voters” are not the ones who decided not to vigorously pursue a solution. The GOP politicians did, after having been labeled and bullied by a loud, but minority, report from talk radio and other perspective mediums. There were many ways to work the steps for comprehensive solutions that would put the government back in the driver’s seat and control the flood of illeagls. But the steps and the solutions themselves are complicated, and the GOP politicians either didn’t have what it took to draft legislation that addressed it or didn’t want to. After all, if they fixed the problem, how could they continue to raise campaign funds based on it? It takes guts, long range vision and the ability to communicate to the masses not only the problem, but the steps to solve it. But the GOP politicians couldn’t do this, and certainly the base certainly didn’t want to hear it.
Amnesty is not a solution by itself and should never have been considered as the “whole ball of wax.” We learned tha the hard way when the Reagan administration tried it. But the GOP let the one issue- and their own fear of the emotional, one-note voice that warned them and labeled them- defeat their higher purpose. In that sense, I suppose the status quo was preserved, but where are we now? Not even one real step closer to a solution. And this cannot be heaped on the shoulders of the left alone. The GOP had a great shot to take the steps necessary to solve the problem-and they let it drop. Were you well represented, if you have an issue with the problems of the illegals? Nope. But it continues to be used by GOP politicians when they use it in their campaign battle cries…So they still sit pretty, having learned that it is easier to say “No” than to risk being labeled by the base.
10 sinz54 // Nov 18, 2009 at 12:14 pm
MI-GOPer:
The FL Tea Partiers have already said that if Crist beats Rubio in the FL primary, they not only won’t work for Crist in the general election, but they want Crist to lose the general election to a Dem. That’s how much they want RINOs out of the party.
11 Churl // Nov 18, 2009 at 12:26 pm
PracticalGirl, “The GOP had a great shot to take the steps necessary to solve the problem-and they let it drop.”
The difficulty is that there is no agreement on what steps are necessary to solve the problem. Hence the long stalemate.
12 MI-GOPer // Nov 18, 2009 at 12:29 pm
Again, sinz54… that is an excellent example of the so-con/econ-con view that it’s their way or the highway. They are the guys who are truly “republicans in name only”. They wouldn’t know a thing about Party loyalty if it sat down on the couch next to ‘em and started eating all the Velvetta.
They’d get mad. But they still wouldn’t know the first thing about Party loyalty.
It’s why Mitt Romney will be the nominee in 2012 and it’s why the GOP under Michael Steele is moving to close GOP state primaries to all but registered or validated republicans. The top pick shouldn’t be decided by folks who aren’t even in the Party… the democrats learned that long ago when they got stuck with Mikey Dukakis.
13 PracticalGirl // Nov 18, 2009 at 12:50 pm
Churl,
Churl-
The GOP spent a great deal of time screaming about illegals being a HUGE problem in the election cycles of 2000 and 2004. Everything from the high cost of medical care to our penal system- anything that is messed up could be laid at the feet of the illegals.
So why, when they had the majority, couldn’t they articulate a solution? That’s the GOP’s current problem in a nutshell. Fabulous at articulating the problem, not so good at articulating a solution. And the base? Exactly the same- loud about the problem and who’s to blame, yet never loud enough to demand real solutions, choosing instead to hurl anagrams and bumper sticker slogans at any politician who might dare to present elegant solutions to complicated problems.
We elect reprecentation to figure out how to take the steps necessary to fix big problems. If the GOP was that unprepared to fix one of their top campaign issues, then they deserved to sit out a cycle or two in the minority. Perhaps next time, they’ll be better prepared to do more than just campaign and complain.
Asking again- given that the status quo is a bungled now as it ever was when it comes to the issue of illegals, were you well represented by the majority party who told you it was not only a huge problem but they would fix it?
14 TL63 // Nov 18, 2009 at 1:24 pm
The Republican Party has a tremendous opportunity to define itself during this break from power. The only way to do that is with serious debate about both our principles and the pragmatic realities of governing. It’s ridiculous to apply litmus tests to specific thoughts and actions by key Republican thinkers and/or elected officials.
It’s fine for Republican legislators in Congress to vote to oppose the stimulus on grounds of principle, especially if they offer viable alternative approaches. The same is true for health care–not that they must offer their own version of a national plan, but tangible real initiatives to get costs under control. As legislators, their role is to participate in an active debate and honestly represent a viewpoint that meets their core principles.
But if you’re a governor, a mayor, or for that matter a business owner, at some point you have to balance your budget. Conservative principles can undergird your actions but discharging the duties of your office must trump ideology. Governor Crist and others in his position are operating with real world issues, not intellectual parlor games.
That’s why Sarah Palin did the right thing resigning as Alaska Governor this summer. For all the jokes (mostly from the left) and comments regarding her supposed lack of intellect, her decision to leave office was very smart, because the responsibilities of governing did not jell with the ideological path she’s pursued. That path will probably enable her to be one of the many voices of our party over the next few years, but make her an unlikely candidate for President. Generally, the American people elect governors as President precisely because they can point to a record of pragmatic achievement over ideological purity. Remember, the most effective advancer of the conservative cause–Ronald Reagan–was also a two-term governor with a record he could point to for legitimacy.
15 PracticalGirl // Nov 18, 2009 at 1:26 pm
Leaving the illegal issue aside…
I think that the criers of “RINO” miss the point of a representative democracy. Not all “conservatives” think or vote in the same way, nor do they want exactly the same things. And some of their elected politicians still understand that their first duty is to represent their elected base, not the populist views of talk radio. And they do this without becoming Dems in the process.
Take Olympia Snowe and health care. She let the health care bill come out of committee for debate, even as she insisted that the public option (as written) was unacceptable to her. But the screamers went wild with their slippery-slope thinking and labeled her a RINO (not for the first time, and certainly not for the last) and called her a traitor to the party.
But here’s the thing: Not only were the spin doctors wrong about her intentions, they completely discounted that Senator Snowe is representative of an electorate who strongly favors a public option. Not the narrow one included in the bill (which a majority polled in Maine are against), but a big, sweeping program similar to Medicare. The Maine polls all show this.
Snowe is still against the public option as written, and has said that the Dems will probably lose her vote because of it. And, given the Maine voters preferences, she also is still representing their wishes to the letter. She took step 1, did not blindly slip into steps 2 and 3, continued to represent her electoral base, and none of it led to her becoming a card-carrying Socialist. Have the criers of “RINO” apologized? Of course not.
16 Independent // Nov 18, 2009 at 1:30 pm
“They’d get mad. But they still wouldn’t know the first thing about Party loyalty.” -mi-gop
I’m not a conservative and not a republican, but i can fully appreciate why any political party would want to screen out of the decision-making processes those people who aren’t interested in the long term interests of the party.
i remember the 1984 democratic party caucus in my home state. i remember high school and college friends going and helping to select massachusetts governor michael dukakis as the nominee. i also remember 6-7 of my frat bros who were hardcore al gore devotees going to vote in the open republican primary because they wanted to make havoc and trouble for the republicans. i think they were voting for jack kemp because he was then seen as some crackpot radical inside the gop.
funny how times change but the games played by political operatives are still the same, today.
17 Independent // Nov 18, 2009 at 1:36 pm
“The GOP spent a great deal of time screaming about illegals being a HUGE problem in the election cycles of 2000 and 2004. Everything from the high cost of medical care to our penal system- anything that is messed up could be laid at the feet of the illegals.” -practicalgirl
i really don’t think that is correct nor an accurate attribution. the reform effort began in the senate as a bill brokered between kennedy and mccain. until the winter 05/spring 06, it was not an issue inside the gop nor on the front page of the newspapers… nor on the memo pads of talk radio. when kennedy and mccain held their joint press conference to announce the package, that’s when it all hit the fan.
and i agree, if i can around here without getting flamed on by the trolls, with mi-gop when he said the fury was really about talk radio generating listeners and making a profit. talk radio and guys like lou dobbs really cashed-in on all the latent bigotry and racism in our society.
18 Raider1 // Nov 18, 2009 at 1:38 pm
David,
The answer is simple. Because it is not just about being in power for power’s sake. It is about being in power to advance conservative ideals of less government, less regulation, strong defense, lower taxes, etc. The last GOP to run the show gave us mammoth deficits, bigger government and tried to fight a war with less than ample troops. What point is being the party in power if you are no less than the one out of power? Power with no true ideological backbone corrupts.
19 NormD // Nov 18, 2009 at 2:03 pm
David,
I have been following you for the last few months, and I am confused.
What do you believe it means to be a Republican? What are the core principles that if a Republican violates you will drop support (and call them a RINO?). The only message that I hear constantly from you is that you want to win so the Democrats won’t. There has to be more than that. If “Republicans” govern the same way as Democrats, why is that better?
The only thing I know for sure is that you despise Sarah Palin and think anyone who supports her is an idiot. I have no strong opinion of her, but I cannot see that your position will help win elections. You cannot just appeal to the center and throw away the core. You have to find common ground between the two. I assume this is the core of politics.
I have no problem with a Republican who is running in a liberal district or state taking some “liberal” positions on, say, social policy, but there has to be some limit.
What defines Republican?
20 rbottoms // Nov 18, 2009 at 2:10 pm
You problem isn’t RINO’s, it’s WACKOS.
Reel this stuff in before it’s too late.
21 PracticalGirl // Nov 18, 2009 at 2:16 pm
Independent,
“i really don’t think that is correct nor an accurate attribution. the reform effort began in the senate as a bill brokered between kennedy and mccain. until the winter 05/spring 06, it was not an issue inside the gop nor on the front page of the newspapers… nor on the memo pads of talk radio.”
You may be right about the newspapers, but you are completely wrong about the rest. “No illegals” was part of the RNC party platform in 2004 and a huge campaign issue of the GOP Congressional class of 2004 as well. Talk radio- Are you kidding me? I was there- a nationally syndicated,, conservative talk radio producer- and sometimes, it was all many of our personalities talked about for weeks, especially when we invited GOP candidates on to talk about their campaign issues.
22 Independent // Nov 18, 2009 at 2:28 pm
“No illegals” was part of the RNC party platform in 2004 and a huge campaign issue of the GOP Congressional class of 2004 as well.”
i was reading the rnc platform online and there’s no mention of illegal immigration in 2004. it only talks about the integral role that immigration reform played in america’s history and progress.
i think you might be confusing your identity as practicalgirl with another identity used elsewhere in this blog?
mi-gop can speak for him/herself. i don’t recall immigration as an issue until the winter 05 and then heating up in the slow news period of spring-summer 06.
i think it was karl rove who said, in 2004, that the hispanic vote was one of the three important legs on the stool of gop victory in 04. practicalgirl, i think you’re horribly confused. how about it mi-gop? she’s off a few bricks of a load, no?
23 Independent // Nov 18, 2009 at 2:29 pm
sorry, not “immigration reform”… that sentence should just read “immigration”. regrets.
24 Independent // Nov 18, 2009 at 2:32 pm
“You problem isn’t RINO’s, it’s WACKOS.” -rbottoms.
i thought you had been expelled and blocked from this site, too, rbottoms? were you able to cut a deal with the webmaster? i know others here have noted you’ve been booted, banned and blocked from more sites than NorthDallasThirty?
25 Churl // Nov 18, 2009 at 2:39 pm
PracticalGirl says, “The GOP spent a great deal of time screaming about illegals being a HUGE problem in the election cycles of 2000 and 2004. Everything from the high cost of medical care to our penal system- anything that is messed up could be laid at the feet of the illegals.
So why, when they had the majority, couldn’t they articulate a solution? ”
They could not articulate a solution because of the intractable differences between the country club set who like cheap yard work, maid services, and nannies, and the ordinary people who have to put up with the lost jobs, increased crime, and the everyday costs and annoyances of an influx of illegal immigrants.
26 CentristNYer // Nov 18, 2009 at 2:41 pm
I’m not sure what the answer is, David. I’m hopeful — as you are — that a smarter, more intellectually honest party will eventually emerge from the ashes, but it’s really hard to see at this point. I’ve been a Republican for almost 30 years and frankly, the GOP has become unrecognizable to me since it was overtaken by the likes of Glenn Beck, Rush Limbaugh, Sarah Palin and their robotic pitchfork brigade. They have nothing to offer the world but arrogance, idiotic conspiracy theories and fabricated Kenyan birth certificates. The party has a long way to go before it shakes off the taint of this crowd. (Just read some of the comments on this site and you see how entrenched this wing nut mindset has become.) I only hope that you and I and some of the other intelligent, fair-minded people who post here can outlast them.
27 PracticalGirl // Nov 18, 2009 at 3:15 pm
Churl,
Country club set, along with American industry that relies on cheap labor- You’ll get no argument from me there. It’s right on target, but didn’t stop the GOP from riling the base about it and promising a solution that they knew, even then, would pit them against the money base.
Independent,
A link, should you choose to follow it. I misspoke- not RNC, but GOP. Co much for tightly controlled borders…
http://www.ontheissues.org/2004_GOP_Platform.htm
No solution, just a position. Which is exactly what we got.
And no, Conspiracy Theorist, I’ve never used another identity on this blog. Fight the issues, along with your own paranoia, will you?
28 Mfairbanks // Nov 18, 2009 at 3:24 pm
RINO is a perfect name for just about all Republicans.
It’s a political party that’s never stood for anything other than selling the USA to other countries piece by piece.
The Democrats are no different.
Both the Democrats and Republicans are doing nothing….I repeat…NOTHING to improve this nation. On the contrary, they are both parasites to liberty.
29 TL63 // Nov 18, 2009 at 3:45 pm
The definition of what is a Republican (position) is constantly changing, and will constantly change. Unfortunately, many times we DID govern like Democrats during the past eight years (e.g., nation-building foreign adventures and rampant spending), and we paid a heavy price. President Bush addressed a major threat–radical Islamic terrorism–and he still deserves credit for that. But as a party, Republicans became too wedded to a status quo that become more about maintaining power as the world was rather than what the world will be. Ironically, the party that supposedly values small government fell in love with it.
Being Republican used to mean being fiscally responsible; now we define that only as cutting taxes. It used to mean embracing personal liberty; now it’s morphed into personal liberty only if your lifestyle choices adhere to a certain norm. And most of all it valued intellect–men and women who acted like grown ups and focused on tangible achievements over celebrity and sizzle.
Health care, taxes, foreign policy, education–these are issues grown ups deal with. Immigration, the wars on terror, abortion, gun control, and gay marriage are all emotionally-charged issues that deserve serious discussion as well, not yelling. But whether our President (and though we may not have voted for him, he’s still our President) can produce a birth certificate or not should be left to the conspiracy nuts, not grown ups.
30 CentristNYer // Nov 18, 2009 at 3:56 pm
TL63, I think that’s a pretty good assessment. Especially that second paragraph. Cutting taxes has become some kind of magic wand for Republicans to wave over any problem, no matter how complex.
31 sinz54 // Nov 18, 2009 at 3:57 pm
TL63:
The problems started when the GOP began to use Christian evangelicals as their shock troops to win elections. That first began in 1982, with the newly formed National Conservative Political Action Committee (NCPAC).
During the Cold War, this problem was masked by the fact that Christian evangelicals wanted to defeat Communism just like all other conservatives did (though for their own reasons–they considered Communism to be atheistic and godless). So they were all on the same page to that extent at least.
But after the Cold War ended and Communism collapsed, the problem became very visible. The agenda of the GOP became increasingly influenced by fundamentalist religion.
So today, we have nationally known conservative columnists attacking Darwin’s Theory of Evolution and flirting with creationism. (Polls reveal that a majority of the GOP base are creationists nowadays.)
We have conservatives in Texas who are opposed to Gardasil, because they actually want to keep the threat of HPV around as a deterrent to premarital sex.
The GOP has now defined itself as the pro-evangelical, anti-science, anti-sex party.
That’s not going to change until the GOP starts bringing in fresh blood from the Northeast, the Pacific Northwest, and other places where this culture and mindset aren’t dominant. The GOP has to commit to winning races in Blue States. That will require them to field a different type of candidate from a Huckabee or a Palin or a DeMint or a Sessions. They will have to recruit candidates who are modernist Christians, educated, suburbanite or even urbanite–and worldly.
32 ottovbvs // Nov 18, 2009 at 3:59 pm
“Experience is a hard teacher, but fools will have no other.”
………So you’re saying that a majority of the GOP today are fools David…..did I get that right?
33 TL63 // Nov 18, 2009 at 5:59 pm
sinz54:
As a Northeastern Republican, I couldn’t agree more. On the religious/evangelical base issue, I also think you’re right, though I’m hopeful we can keep them in the party. In fact, candidates representing some of their positions can win in the Northeast–but tone is important.
Here in NJ, we just elected the first pro-life governor (Chris Christie) we’ve ever had (since Roe v. Wade). As a pro-life Catholic, I was surprised I wasn’t aware of that “first” when someone pointed that out to me. The reason is that while I was certainly aware of Christie’s position, it wasn’t the focus of his campaign, though Corzine tried to make it so. Instead, Christie focused on taxes and jobs, which was what New Jerseyans cared about in 2009. I’d suggest we need to take a similar approach on abortion and other saocial issues to be competitive going forward, both here and in other regions of the country.
34 rbottoms // Nov 18, 2009 at 6:09 pm
There you go, thinking again.
It works much better when your head is pulled from your third point of contact.
35 rbottoms // Nov 18, 2009 at 6:11 pm
Fixed.
The GOP has now defined itself as the pro-evangelical, anti-science, anti-sex party.
That’s not going to change.
36 Oldskool // Nov 18, 2009 at 8:18 pm
The chickens are coming home to roost so what’s happening shouldn’t come as a surprise. In the late 70’s and early 80’s a conscious decision was made to hitch the party to an untapped source of support, values voters. They were encouraged to be loud and to bully and they do a good job of it. As long as (R)s rely on a Lee Atwater or a Karl Rove to whip the troops into a frenzy every two or four years, they’ll always be hostage to the screamers and snarlers. It’s the same mindset that keeps kids in poor neighborhoods from “snitching”.
37 CharlieFremont // Nov 18, 2009 at 9:56 pm
I’m getting tired of the Rino debate. Let’s start calling labeling the GOP’s cliques a bit more accurately. For instance, we have the Kirk/Buckley conservatives, the Ron Paul/Calvin Coolidge libertarians, the Rockefeller/Roosevelt progressives, Lugar and Frum’s neo-conservative internationalist, Buchannan/Helms traditionalist, etc. Remarkable thing is each group share profound visions yet profoundly differ on just as many issues. Bottom line is rigorous policy debate and subjecting those policies to the Republican voters in closed yet transparent primaries is essential.
Rockefeller and his ilk were repulsive to many but for decades they held sway. The conservatives and traditionalist held mometary power but they have too often been overwhelmed by the establishment types, read Lugar, the Bushes, Dole, Ford, etc.
Americans were fooled by G.W. Bushes limp-wristed and meandering administration and the GOP House and Senate majorities wasted tenure. They were fired and replaced by a man promising “hope and change.” O’Bama has been revealed a conniving pol too as he appeases the worst elements on the international stage and send his legion of rule makers and tax collectors across the republic. Who can blame Americans for being angry. Let’s talk about what made Hoffman in New York so attractive so quickly to so many. Let’s be honest about Ron Paul’s appeal to so many of our young and for goodness sake, let’s be content to just go at it vis-a-vis the principals and policies that animate us.
38 rbottoms // Nov 18, 2009 at 10:00 pm
**cough**
He got his head handed to him in the election. See, you get political power by… winning.
More victories like that one and you will be undone.
39 BoolaBoola // Nov 18, 2009 at 10:17 pm
The fact is, the core of the Republican DOES NOT CARE, and never has cared, about governing.
The Republican Party today is still caught in the years from 1954 to 1994, when Dems had automatic control of the legislature, and all the Republicans could hope for was to slow things down and profit off their nuisance value. The Newt-Gingrich method only works when you’re in the minority.
Nuisance value is not a governing principle.
40 AmericanMuser // Nov 18, 2009 at 10:46 pm
“Disillusioned” is the word that best describes how many Americans feel after eight years of George Bush and the election of Barack Obama a year ago. Republicans had a majority in congress and the presidency, yet achieved little for Middle America. They betrayed voters by inflating the deficit and growing government, sending men and women into nation-building wars whose purposes are still unknown, and created a culture of moral and ethical corruption in Washington D.C. It was under lax and pathetic regulatory oversight that a Republican president and Republican congress allowed corporations to betray shareholders with questionable and highly leveraged credit default swaps, only to be followed by a $700 billion taxpayer bailout created by the Bush administration—so much for limited government. Republicans are a party without a message and without a messenger.
Last week’s election results in Virginia and New Jersey, where Republican candidates for governor triumphed over their Democrat opponents, say more about the public’s rejection of Obama’s big government solutions and less about Republicans articulating a message to help Middle America. If Republicans think the public is embracing the party again, they are simply whistling past the graveyard, drunk on their own greed, and completely out of touch with the needs of Middle America.
Not that Democrats are offering any worthwhile solutions to address the most pressing needs of Middle America—job creation—but at least Democrats are intellectually honest about their desire for big government, universal healthcare, taxpayer-funded abortions, labor union power, and a litigious society for plaintiff lawyers to fleece the public. There is something, dare I say “refreshing and frank” about knowing where Democrats are on issues that impact Middle America, whereas Republicans pretend to be something they are not.
It is time for the Republican party to stop blindly whoring for the business community and begin addressing the issues that impact Middle America—job creation, affordable healthcare for all, and quality public education for our children. Republicans are a one-trick-pony, where “tax cuts” are their solution for all of Middle America’s problems. It’s because the party cannot articulate rational policy solutions to the real problems we face.
Take healthcare for instance; the Republican solution has been health savings accounts (HSAs). Are you kidding me? We can’t get people to save money in IRAs, never mind HSAs. That’s the best Republicans have got? Why don’t Republicans push to allow consumers to shop for healthcare across state lines, require everyone to have healthcare, and deny insurers from rejecting consumers with pre-existing conditions?
If Democrats have any hope of maintaining power, they too need to put viable solutions on the table for Middle America, where people care a hell of a lot more about jobs and the economy than government-run healthcare, union card check, the protection of gays from hate crimes, and cap and trade. Both parties have failed miserably to address the needs of Middle America, which I suppose is why I feel so disillusioned with both parties.
A. Muser
http://americanmuser.wordpress.com
41 MI-GOPer // Nov 18, 2009 at 10:59 pm
rbottoms, the democrat troll who gets bounced from more blogs than Biden has plugs, says: “**cough** He got his head handed to him in the election. See, you get political power by… winning. More victories like that one and you will be undone.”
Ahhhh, the vote isn’t official yet, my blog bouncing troll friend. Some NY pundits are saying –backed by a new study from Cornell– that it’s feasible Hoffman did win the election and the careful counting of the absentee ballots could turn the election over to Hoffman.
I’d get ready if I were you to eat a big-assed plate of crow, richard. It’d be fitting for a troll like you.
42 MI-GOPer // Nov 18, 2009 at 11:01 pm
Mr Muser opines: “Take healthcare for instance; the Republican solution has been health savings accounts (HSAs). Are you kidding me?”
Sorry Mr Muser, either you haven’t been listening or your dead asleep at your post. There are many GOP alternatives to the ObamaCare TakeOver and the Democrat’s War on Medicine.
This site has presented some. Google it and learn instead of adding darkness to your corner of reality.
43 MI-GOPer // Nov 18, 2009 at 11:05 pm
OldSkrewl does his best to reinvigorate the long lost spirit of Rev Jeremiah Wright, last seen being tossed under the bus by his pupil and former 22 yr church member, Barrie Obama… “The chickens are coming home to roost”.
You really need to self-edit there, OldSkrewl. You’ve been worshiping at the Obama Altar a wee bit too long. You need a break when you start quoting the discredited, bus-done-runned-over Rev Wright.
44 MI-GOPer // Nov 18, 2009 at 11:11 pm
General Fremont says “Americans were fooled by G.W. Bushes limp-wristed and meandering administration and the GOP House and Senate majorities wasted tenure.”
Scratch the dirt and out pops a libertarian loon praising the good Doctor Paul and sharing his disdain for anything that isn’t pure enuff for the loon brigade.
Hey Fremont, you’re no “Great Pathfinder” pal. The libertarian party has an address; find it, join up, let the GOP attend to rebuilding the Party… you keep focused on getting 000.005% of the vote and making Bob Barr credible, ok? That’s a big enough task for you at this point.
45 CentristNYer // Nov 19, 2009 at 12:18 am
MI-GOPer: Let me guess — in real life you’re the obnoxious barfly that no one listens to but never shuts up.
46 Brad Smith // Nov 19, 2009 at 12:21 am
Republicans would benefit greatly if the word “RINO” were dropped from the party’s vocabulary.
47 Oldskool // Nov 19, 2009 at 8:39 am
MI-GOPer: You’re the kind of person Frum keeps talking about, petulant loudmouths who think they can bully everyone. In person you’d pee your pants before you’d get up the nerve to say those things to someone’s face.
48 MI-GOPer // Nov 19, 2009 at 9:08 am
Wow, it turns out that our newest troll, CentristNyer isn’t exactly centrist… he’s just another mean-spirited name-calling troll.
And imagine our surprise? OldSkrewl joins in with some more name-calling and mindless taunts. Just a suggestion, OldSkrewl, get your facts straight… when Frum talks about losers hampering the GOP from rebuilding the Party… he’s talking about losers, cyber stalkers and trolls like you who comes to incite, inflame, annoy and irritate without purpose or constructive gain.
But I can appreciate why you’d like to spin it another way –even if it stretches credibility beyond Chuckie Schumer’s hairplug line or wider than a Debbie Stabenow. You are such a weak sister, OldSkrewl.
49 Oldskool // Nov 19, 2009 at 10:32 am
MI-GOPer;
Lucky for you the people who created this site obviously don’t read it or you’d be gone already. Your motus operandi is to drag everyone else down into the gutter with you and sometimes you’re succcessful so you should be congratulated, you perfectly represent todays GOP.
50 Addie // Nov 19, 2009 at 1:40 pm
Frum – “Why is it that those of us who are willing to do what it takes to beat Democrats are called “Republicans in name only” or worse? Meanwhile those conservatives willing to accept years of Democratic government rather than adjust any point congratulate themselves on their commitment and dedication.”
Why you ask? Well I will tell you! Because this country has been going in the wrong direction for many years and it is the fault of both democrats and RINO republicans and we the people are tired of it! We don’t want someone in office that “will do what it takes to beat Democrats” when they are a democrat themselves. Where is the win? How is that actually beating the democrats when the RINO votes with the democrat anyway?
What happened to the republicans being fiscally conservative and all about small government? Sorry, but I will not vote for a RINO, I would sooner vote for the democrat! I voted for ShIthouse in Rhode Island instead of Linc Chafee because I’d rather have a democrat then a fraud and a liar!
Sadly, I doubt Republicans learned their lesson in NY-23. They will in 2010 if they continue to stick RINO’s on the ballet. The Republican party needs to go back to their roots!
51 sinz54 // Nov 19, 2009 at 2:09 pm
Oldskool:
What the GOP is slowly beginning to realize,
is that the strategy of turning out the base is no longer a winning strategy.
The reason is that today, Independents are the largest bloc of voters by far–larger than registered Dems or registered Repubs.
And how the Independents vote determines the election. If Independents vote Dem as they did in 2006 and 2008, then it won’t matter if the GOP base turns out. The GOP will lose anyway.
52 sinz54 // Nov 19, 2009 at 2:15 pm
AmericanMuser:
The Commodity Futures Modernization Act of 2000, which gutted the SEC’s power to regulate Credit Default Swaps, was signed into law by President Clinton.
The Clinton Administration had a lot of pro-business people in it like Robert Rubin, Larry Summers, etc.
This Act, which sowed the seeds for the disaster of 2008, was pushed by Robert Rubin, Alan Greenspan, and Phil Gramm. (It also sowed the seeds for the Enron disaster too.) And Clinton signed it. It was truly a bipartisan disaster.
53 sinz54 // Nov 19, 2009 at 2:19 pm
AmericanMuser:
That was EXACTLY the McCain health care reform proposal in his 2008 campaign.
But he didn’t win.
The Heritage Foundation is still pushing a reform package along those lines.
But be realistic. With the massive liberal majorities in both houses of congress, the GOP has absolutely no chance of any of their proposals being accepted. Olympia Snowe tried to just put a trigger on the public option. After five months of negotiations, the Dems got nailed by their liberal base and even this modest proposal was rejected.
54 Hikaru // Nov 19, 2009 at 11:46 pm
“The Heritage Foundation is still pushing a reform package along those lines.
But be realistic. With the massive liberal majorities in both houses of congress, the GOP has absolutely no chance of any of their proposals being accepted.”
But the problem is, THF is still pushing for sweeping upper-class tax cuts and virtually no oversight on private insurers practices. You can have a good idea, but surrounding it with bad ones doesn’t help it.
Same applies for Obamacare, but from a person who knows nothing of the inside politics (or average voter), they see someone trying to do something. Just yelling no at everything only gets you so far.
55 MI-GOPer // Nov 20, 2009 at 9:08 am
OldSkrewl opines: “Lucky for you the people who created this site obviously don’t read it or you’d be gone already.”
Wrong-o, troll breath. I am in frequent contact with David Frum and lots of fellow moderate GOPers –as well as intellectual conservatives– who share a concern about the direction of the GOP and how the conservative movement fits into that effort. If you knew anything beyond saiting your self-interest, you’d know from my comments here that I participate in CPAC, in the Federalist Society, Brookings, MainStreet and the Natl Press Club.
But, like other trolls here, you don’t care to stick to the truth. It’s whatever you need to manufacture in your brain to reassure your ample ass isn’t on the chopping block with the Obama Messiah’s downward trend toward a One Term Legacy.
I get it. You’re motivated by self-interest of hard core partisan rhetoric. I wouldn’t be surprised if you are one of the last cowards manning the barricades around the White House as the new GOP Presidential Team of 2012 comes to evict the Obama Messiah.
56 MI-GOPer // Nov 20, 2009 at 9:11 am
By the way, OldSkrewl, you got p’wned here:
OldSkrewl joins in with some more name-calling and mindless taunts. Just a suggestion, OldSkrewl, get your facts straight… when Frum talks about losers hampering the GOP from rebuilding the Party… he’s talking about losers, cyber stalkers and trolls like you who comes to incite, inflame, annoy and irritate without purpose or constructive gain.
But I can appreciate why you’d like to spin it another way –even if it stretches credibility beyond Chuckie Schumer’s hairplug line or wider than a Debbie Stabenow. You are such a weak sister, OldSkrewl.
Imagine something wider than ol’ Bessie StupidCow’s ample backside? Or farther than ChuckieSchumer’s hairplug line? Impossible.
57 rbottoms // Nov 20, 2009 at 1:11 pm
Ever seen the movie Barfly? Best interpretation of Bukowski’s writing. Anyway, he and that other guy are in my ignore list. I don’t waste the electrons responding to them.
Uh, we increased our majority in the House of Representatives. You know, the body that makes the laws. Governorships are nice stepping stones to running for president, but since at least one senator has disproved you can’t get to the White House from that chamber there’s less shine than before.
Please, let’s have more teabagger victories like NY-23.
58 handworn // Nov 24, 2009 at 2:12 pm
rbottoms, both nominees were Senators in the 2008 race. That doesn’t prove much. The 1960 race is more like it, in which a Senator beat someone with experience in the executive branch.
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