See Ya!

July 26th, 2009 at 11:12 pm by David Frum | 69 Comments |

Sarah Palin’s most notable achievement as governor of Alaska was to increase the payout from the state’s energy tax take by $1200 per resident. Isn’t it odd then that she would use her farewell address to warn against the danger of government handouts?

69 responses so far

1 midcon // Jul 26, 2009 at 11:20 pm

David, We get it. You don’t like Palin. You’ve been telling us that for a long time. Dead horse and all that. Give it rest.
2 sdspringy // Jul 27, 2009 at 1:55 am

Why does the national media continue to provide poll numbers on Palin at a rate greater than the current VP or President?
Why does Frumm, NYT, consider Palin such a threat. A threat she must be because why pay any attention to a one hit wonder. Frumm is only scared that the conservative swing which is coming on the heels of the current Dem lunacy will propel Palin into the front. Basicaly making this blog mute.
Frumm won’t get his progressive, Dem lite version of the Republican party if Palin rides the wave which is coming.
So Frumm like the NYT, SNL, WashPost, LAtimes are all worried more than you realize.
3 VA Shepherd // Jul 27, 2009 at 7:36 am

Giving Alaskans a share of their state’s resources is a far cry from the new tax programs proposed by team Obama. David is making this stretch to make what point?
4 barker13 // Jul 27, 2009 at 8:06 am

Re: VA Shepherd // Jul 27, 2009 at 7:36 am –

Actually, VAS, in a sense this is yet another health policy thread.

Only this time Frum is focusing on his own disease – PDS – Palin Derangement Syndrome.

BILL
5 Chekote // Jul 27, 2009 at 8:21 am

I just hope that the North Star guides Palin’s brazeningly, bold Alaska self out of the Republican Party. This woman is a complete disaster. She hurts the Republican Party. She hurt the conservative movement.
6 oroenpaz // Jul 27, 2009 at 8:25 am

Watched David on CNN twice in last two weeks. I am convinced he is a liar.
He intentionally misleads, talking about soldier’s desires, Palin said don’t make
things up, Frum lied by saying she said stop criticizing me. Makes up “facts”,
misleads in interpretation. Frum is a LIAR. Returning government surplus to
the citizens is a new govt program, Frum is a joke.
7 3wood // Jul 27, 2009 at 8:28 am

Your Fox segment sounded like a Axelrod interview. Your take on Palin like McCain’s staff view Pain with between the beltway eyes.. The rest of the country however view her as one of their own and feel very passionately about her. After 4 years of Obama I can see Pailin winning in a landslide as people start to wake up from their Obama comas.
8 Chekote // Jul 27, 2009 at 8:37 am

The rest of the country however view her as one of their own and feel very passionately about her.

A recent poll shows that 53% of Americans have a negative view of Palin. She only appeals to the Theocratic wing of the GOP.
9 barker13 // Jul 27, 2009 at 8:39 am

(*WHISTLING*)

(*SLAPPING MY LEG*)

David! Hey… DAVID…!

LOOK! Look here, boy! Com’ere… that’s a good boy…

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970203946904574300013592601036.html

I figure if we just treat DF like a dog – distract him from humping the visitor’s leg – perhaps that’ll work.

(Hey… it’s worth a shot!)

BILL
10 Chekote // Jul 27, 2009 at 8:53 am

Bill

I can’t believe you support Palin. She gave another incoherent speech and her constant lashing at the media makes her look thin skinned. Have all the conservatives forgotten what was said about Hillary? For goodness sake she was accused of murdering Vince Foster!
11 sinz54 // Jul 27, 2009 at 9:10 am

3wood: Sarah Palin represents the last gasp of a RedState (I use that term deliberately) culture that has now shrunk too small to elect a President on its own anymore.

The “rest of the country” that you speak of, includes the Deep South and some Mountain States, that’s it.

The fastest growing voting blocs in America today are single women (including single moms) and Hispanics. Sarah Palin has nothing to say to either. The crowds she draws are uniformly white, married Christians from conservative parts of the nation.
12 KoolJeffrey // Jul 27, 2009 at 9:14 am

Palin’s rambling farewell was a testimony to all the great things she did as governor. My question is this: If she really thought she was doing such a great job, then why is she depriving her beloved Alaska of her most excellent governance? It doesn’t make a bit a sense.

If she is letting bloggers and local media types drive her out of office, then what does that say about her resolve? I thought Republicans were supposed to be so strong-willed, no matter what the odds. George W. Bush certainly was. She is mostly concerned with the ceremony of public office and not much else, it seems.
13 Chekote // Jul 27, 2009 at 9:17 am

Hi Sinz,

Last week I attended a meeting with the local county GOP chairman. Even here in Texas more and more Republicans are speaking out against the TheoCon (RedState) wing of the party. Things are looking up.
14 Chekote // Jul 27, 2009 at 9:20 am

kooljeffrey

Palin is looking at the earning potential. She obviously is not interested in learning about the issues or governing. She enjoyed it as long as artificially high oil prices were bringing in buckets of cash into the Alaska treasury. Now that the economy has gone south, she bails. A profile in courage, indeed.
15 KoolJeffrey // Jul 27, 2009 at 9:26 am

Chekote sez:

“A recent poll shows that 53% of Americans have a negative view of Palin. She only appeals to the Theocratic wing of the GOP.”

I believe that number would be higher if she was in the middle of a campaign. Everytime she opens her mouth, she offends another demographic.
16 Rubicon // Jul 27, 2009 at 9:38 am

Palin’s gift is her ability to out syntax America.
17 barker13 // Jul 27, 2009 at 9:41 am

Re: Chekote // Jul 27, 2009 at 8:53 am –

“Bill, I can’t believe you support Palin.”

Ahh… but laying that aside… can you believe I disdain Frum?

(*WINK*)

Re: Sinz54 // Jul 27, 2009 at 9:10 am –

Hey, Sinz… here… read something that matters:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204886304574307932274150934.html

Re: Kooljeffrey // Jul 27, 2009 at 9:14 am –

“Kool” Jeffrey…???

Ahh… yes… another legend in his own mind!

(*CHUCKLE*)

BILL
18 midcon // Jul 27, 2009 at 9:44 am

Well David, I see by all the posts here that you have a lot of company in your disdain for Palin. The response to Palin may even exceed the negative response to Hillary. Interesting. The emotional content in these responses demonstrates that Palin is a fairly polarizing figure, but I am amazed at the nearly all consuming passion regarding her from you and the responders here. The lack of dispassionate analysis and discourse is troubling because it reinforces my view that the greatest ill of our nation is the lack of quiet governance that seeks solutions based on sound reasoning rather than the emotional decision-making that pervades our political process including the electorate. While passion can move mountains, more often it expends itself in sound and fury with nothing to show for it. I continue to seek signs that we can rise above these petty differences and set aside the fury that continues to define both the left and right. I continue to be disappointed.
19 Morning Skim: Not Talking About Crime Rates and Race - The Opinionator Blog - NYTimes.com // Jul 27, 2009 at 9:59 am

[...] Majority: David Frum notes that “Sarah Palin’s most notable achievement as governor of Alaska was to increase the payout from the state’s energy tax take by $1200 per [...]
20 KoolJeffrey // Jul 27, 2009 at 10:02 am

All the “(* SMILEYS *)” in barker13’s posts make him sound like a 14-year-old girl.

(* TEE HEE *)
21 KoolJeffrey // Jul 27, 2009 at 10:04 am

midcon sez:

“The response to Palin may even exceed the negative response to Hillary. ”

Funny, I don’t recall Sarah Palin being accused of murdering her law partner and friend.
22 Chekote // Jul 27, 2009 at 10:41 am

midcon

Palin’s support is based on pure emotion.
23 barker13 // Jul 27, 2009 at 10:47 am

Re: Kooljeffrey // Jul 27, 2009 at 10:02 am –

“All the “(* SMILEYS *)” in barker13’s posts make him sound like a 14-year-old girl.”

That’s “smiles,” not “smileys.” (*CHUCKLE*)

So… “Kool”… tell us more about your fixation on 14 year old girls…

(*HUGE FRIGG’N GRIN*)

Jeezus… thank frigg’n God for Mid!

The problem is, Mid, as you do note… these frigg’n jamokes are SERIOUS!

I mean… while I’m seriously skewering Frum while at the same time going for the cheap chuckle, these wackadoos are ACTUALLY obsessed with Sarah Palin.

The sad thing is… none of them even bother to actually address the substance of Palin’s “fairwell” address. No cutting and pasting… not reference to actual in context text.

Again… no one enjoys “kidding around” and “ball busting” more than I do, but, jeez… the almost total lack of substance one gets from the peanut gallery… it’s downright depressing.

Anyway… (*SHRUG*)

BILL (Not “Kool” Bill… just… plain… Bill…)
24 sinz54 // Jul 27, 2009 at 10:59 am

barker13 sez: “I mean… while I’m seriously skewering Frum while at the same time going for the cheap chuckle, these wackadoos are ACTUALLY obsessed with Sarah Palin.”

Obsessed?

Sarah Palin is the darling of the GOP base. If you don’t believe that, then surf over to RedState.com and see for yourself.

If Sarah Palin wanted the 2012 GOP nomination, she could get it. And that, in Frum’s view and in my view, would be a disaster. Unless the Obama Administration is as despised in 2012 as Carter’s was in 1980, the GOP would lose 40 states, at least–and Obama’s coattails would ensure he would keep large majorities in Congress.

That must not be allowed to happen.

As things t
25 ronomcdono83 // Jul 27, 2009 at 11:58 am

I agree with oroenpaz, Frum is a liar and sounded dumb on CNN this morning. His arguments didn’t even make sense. Returning government surplus IS NOT THE SAME as government handouts that will increase the deficit even more.

It is obvious that he has some extreme hatred for Palin and will make up anything to save his “new republican party.” Oh, and stop trying to connect yourself to Reagan.
26 DFL // Jul 27, 2009 at 12:37 pm

Sarah Palin is almost irrelevant right now. The 2012 Presidential election will be a simple up or down on Barack Obama’s presidency. Sarah Palin is in the mix for Republican nominee but I expect that Mitt Romney will win the nomination. That said, the Republican Party remains an incoherent party that just had a flame-out, disgraced presidency. The Republicans would be better off winning the non-presidential election years of 2010 and 2014 but allowing Obama to win re-election in 2012 so that the Democrats can experience the political barnacles that go with running the White House. Let’s just hope that if the presidency is for the taking in 2016 that Jeb Bush doesn’t get nominated. The Bush family has done enough damage to the Republican Party.

Remember, transformational presidents like Reagan and FDR are created by the political failures of the incumbent government which works to galvanize the opposition, discourages the incumbent party and attracts the mushy middle. Reagan and FDR would never have won the presidency if it wasn’t for the incompetence of Carter and Hoover.
27 KoolJeffrey // Jul 27, 2009 at 12:45 pm

I love Palin. She could throw some spiciness into the mix of staid, boring old candidates like Mitt Romney, Jeb Bush, or Tim Pawlenty in 2012. If any of those guys gets the nomination, look for a giant (*YAWN*) coming from Palin supporters. Even Huckabee woudn’t be able to get their juices flowing if Sarah Barracuda was out there barnstorming her way from southern Red states to… uh, I guess there really isn’t anywhere else for her to go. Even the frozen tundra of Alaska has had enough of her.
28 Quote of the Day, Palin Edition | Heretical Ideas Blog // Jul 27, 2009 at 12:47 pm

[...] “Sarah Palin’s most notable achievement as governor of Alaska was to increase the payout from the state’s energy tax take by $1200 per resident. Isn’t it odd then that she would use her farewell address to warn against the danger of government handouts?” – David Frum [...]
29 SharonMcEachern // Jul 27, 2009 at 12:58 pm

I’m certain it will be a relief for Palin not having to keep her eye on Russia as Alaska’s governor. Now she’ll have time to go hunting and try out that Mother’s Day gift from the National Rifle Assn. Palin, a NRA life-member, was given a custom-made rifle, named “Alaskan Hunter,” described as a “war weapon,” a civilian model of the M-16 assault rifle. Ethic Soup has a good post on Palin’s sweet assault rifle at:

http://www.ethicsoup.com/2009/05/gangsta-gov-sarah-palin-gets-sweet-assault-rifle-from-nra-happy-mothers-day.html

Oh by the way, this weapon is so powerful that it can blow-to-bits even the largest wild animal in Alaska, so you would not be able to identify the animal. It’s just what every mother needs who aspires to national office and wants a showdown with the media. Yesterday, in her bye-bye (if only it were true) speech, Palin said: “We eat; therefore, we hunt!”
30 Oneon1isto // Jul 27, 2009 at 1:40 pm

Some people here seem to confuse news items on her as equating electoral legitimacy. Pretty, famous people doing ridiculous things = tabloid sideshow, but not much else.

Side thought: I want this to be known, I’m throwing down my prediction right here. Bill, write down the date for me and get it notarized in triplicate:

If Republican’s continue to stagnate next election cycle, they will blame the MSM (and now blogs, they’re part of the cabal now too) for turning Sarah Palin into the face of the GOP, thus causing more electoral defeats.

Sealed signed and delivered.
31 So Long, Farewell, auf Wiedersehen, Good Night « Around The Sphere // Jul 27, 2009 at 1:48 pm

[...] David Frum at New Majority: Sarah Palin’s most notable achievement as governor of Alaska was to increase the payout from the state’s energy tax take by $1200 per resident. Isn’t it odd then that she would use her farewell address to warn against the danger of government handouts? [...]
32 raygun // Jul 27, 2009 at 2:10 pm

Palin’s as intellectually weak and impossible to take seriously as any parenthetical expression (*BELCH*)
33 groverge // Jul 27, 2009 at 2:11 pm

Alaska is essentially a welfare state, living off the largesse of federal pork and oil companies. My Governor’s poll numbers would be sky-high, too, if he got rid of state taxes and paid every man, woman and child in the state $3400; but, then, Georgia doesn’t have oil reserves. Maybe if Palin hadn’t increased the transfers from the oil companies to the residents, the companies could have spent more money on exploration and drilling. What I’ve never understood is why Alaska has fewer residents than the county I live in, but has almost three times the number of state employees (18,000)that my county has (6,500). If you add up all the municipal and tribal workers, I bet 10-15% or more of the state residents are on the public payroll, a huge percentage of the adult population. But I guess this state, and its former Governor, are what qualify as conservative these days.
34 » Quote of the Day Liberal Values // Jul 27, 2009 at 3:58 pm

[...] she would use her farewell address to warn against the danger of government handouts?”–David Frum Posted in Sarah Palin. RSS. [...]
35 Below The Beltway » Blog Archive » Quote Of The Day: Hockey Mom Edition // Jul 27, 2009 at 4:06 pm

[...] — David Frum [...]
36 jscrump // Jul 27, 2009 at 4:24 pm

Daivd Frum has lost me as supporter for any beltway, business as usual, republican nominees, by his repeated attacks against the conservative base.

David is as graceless as the McCain campaign’s staffers who bash their nominee’s VP choice, while hiding behind the skirts of anonymity.

As for the intellectuals who seem to prize their own cleverness above all else, it was Tina Fey who made the comment that, “I can see Russia from my front step.” And exactly how many here know the names and leaders of at least two-dozen countries off the top of their head? Does anybody know anything about Thomas Paine’s Common Sense other that it exists without Googling it?

Good luck with that “big tent” thing without us.

Regards,
Jeff Crump, registered Republican who voted for Carter(I was only 18), Reagan, Bush, Forbes, Bush, and McCain (held my nose)
Eldridge, IA
37 Chekote // Jul 27, 2009 at 4:29 pm

The lesson of all this was, of course, that because we’re a great nation, our challenges seem complex. It will always be this way. But as long as we remember our first principles and believe in ourselves, the future will always be ours. – Ronald Reagan’s Farewell Speech

And now we have this:

And it is our men and women in uniform securing it, and we are facing tough challenges in America with some seeming to just be Hell bent maybe on tearing down our nation, perpetuating some pessimism, and suggesting American apologetics, suggesting perhaps that our best days were yesterdays. – Sarah Palin’s Farewell Speech
38 PaulFrank // Jul 27, 2009 at 5:01 pm

Jeff Crump (#36) is dead right: It was comedian Tina Fey who made the “see Russia from my front porch” comment.

Gov. Palin only said this on that subject:

“[Russians are] our next-door neighbors, and you can actually see Russia from land here in Alaska, from an island in Alaska.” –Sept. 11, 2008 to ABC News.

And this:

“It’s very important when you consider even national security issues with Russia as Putin rears his head and comes into the air space of the United States of America, where – where do they go? It’s Alaska. It’s just right over the border.” –the infamous Katie Couric interview

And, last but not least, this from AP:

“Palin has never visited Russia, and until last year the 44-year-old first-term Alaska governor had never traveled outside North America. She also had never met a foreign leader until her trip this week to New York.”

Oh yes, so reassuring. Thank you for setting our intellectually stunted minds at ease, Mr. Crump.

As for not knowing the names of two dozen world leaders, speak for yourself. Thankfully, at least I can assume that you aren’t running for the Vice Presidency of the United States.
39 barker13 // Jul 27, 2009 at 5:10 pm

Re: Sinz54 // Jul 27, 2009 at 10:59 am –

“Obsessed?”

Yes, Sinz, obsessed. Do you want a gold star for reading comprehension or typing skill?

(*SNORT*)

As I type I’m noticing we’re up to 37 posts here. Thirty seven!

(*SHAKING MY HEAD IN RUEFUL AMUSEMENT*)

“Sarah Palin is the darling of the GOP base.”

She’s very popular. (*SHRUG*) Thanks for… er… noting the obvious.

(Mid – is it me…??? Is there something in the water supply…???) (*SNORT*)

“If Sarah Palin wanted the 2012 GOP nomination, she could get it.”

(*ROLLING MY EYES*)

(*SIGH*) Sinz. It’s July 27 2009. Chill. There’s a long way to go till 2012. No one has a lock on the 2012 GOP nomination.

(Mid… I’m dealing with morons here… I mean, sorry to drag you into this, but as a fellow voice of reason, what do you make of this PDS?)

“Unless the Obama Administration is as despised in 2012 as Carter’s was in 1980…”

There’s a very good chance this will indeed be the case, Sinz.

“As things t…”

Sinz…??? You alright, buddy…???

BILL
40 barker13 // Jul 27, 2009 at 5:21 pm

Re: Oneon1isto // Jul 27, 2009 at 1:40 pm –

“Bill, write down the date for me and get it notarized in triplicate:”

(*SUMMONING MY SECRETARY*) (*WINK*)

Re: Raygun // Jul 27, 2009 at 2:10 pm –

“…(*BELCH*)…”

(*NOD*) Not bad, Popgun, not bad at all…

(*POLITE RESTRAINED APPLAUSE*)

Re: Jscrump // Jul 27, 2009 at 4:24 pm –

(*SIGH*)

David Frum… DAVID… YO… DAVID…!!! You’re doing a bang up job. (*SMIRK*)

Re: Chekote // Jul 27, 2009 at 4:29 pm –

Fair enough, Chekote. Obviously we could spend the day exchanging snippets of Palin speeches – you posting clips that make her look foolish, me posting clips which reflect well on her – but at least you’re addressing something the woman actually said.

(*CLAP-CLAP-CLAP*)

(Jeez… I hope Sinz didn’t collapse while typing or something… that was weird how his post just trailed off…)

BILL
41 sinz54 // Jul 27, 2009 at 5:55 pm

It’s unnecessary to debate quotes from Sarah Palin.

It’s more important to look at how the GOP can expand from being a minority party to a majority party.

Sarah Palin appeals only to the GOP base, the bedrock faithful–and to no one else. No swing voters, no Independent voters, and certainly no voters in Blue districts, are going to look at Sarah Palin and consider voting Republican.

The GOP base is going to have to face a couple of unpleasant truths: Their views are out of step with the rest of the nation. A candidate whose policies can appeal to the rest of the nation is going to be advocating some policies that the GOP base won’t like.

That’s what it means to have a “big tent” party–everybody doesn’t always agree on everything.
42 midcon // Jul 27, 2009 at 6:36 pm

It is almost as if Palin is a trigger word and everyone here is having a Pavlovian response to her. Yes, she is popular with the base, but then the base comprises only 23% of the electorate, so certainly not enough to get Sarah elected. I can’t tell if it is Palinphobia or Basephobia but folks sure get excited.

Sarah may or may not prove to be influential and a consevative force in the future. She either will or will not. Foaming at the mouth about her will not change that future. Just because she can field dress a moose does not qualify her for higher office, but how many of you can field dress a moose? She is a pretty strong and independent woman. And from what I have seen over the years from Congress and some of our other leaders (both left and right), she might even be a better choice. Yeah sure, she doesn’t have the credentials, but look what you get out of Congress these days. Their credentials have not done us a lot of good thus far. That’s what you should be afraid of. People might actually be fed up with the crap that passes for governance from today’s crop of leaders. Maybe field dressing mooses (is that the correct way to say it) is just as good of a credential as the trial lawyers, comedians, car salesmen, and other hacks that we have in Congress. Could it get any worse with Sarah?

Don’t get me wrong, I’m not a Palinite but let’s have some balance here. If you are gonna trash Palin, let’s give equal trashing to people like Dodd. Who has done the most damage to nation between those two? As I said before, let’s give Sarah a rest and stick it to those folks on the Hill who are the ones really responsible for the state of the nation.

This obsession (and yeah Barker, it seems to be an obsession) is almost Freudian and we all know there is a fine line between love and hate.
43 anniemargret // Jul 27, 2009 at 8:22 pm

Sarah Palin quotes:

“They are also building schools for the Afghan children so that there is hope and opportunity in our neighboring country of Afghanistan.”
“All of ‘em, any of ‘em that have been in front of me over all these years.” (to the question about what newspapers she reads)
“I think on a national level your Department of Law there in the White House would look at some of the things that we’ve been charged with and automatically throw them out.” (Dept of Law??)
“…seem to just be hell-bent on maybe tearing down our nation, perpetuating some pessimism and suggesting American apologetics.”
“How sad that Washington and the media will never understand; it’s about country. Uh, huh. No doubt folks from the pro-American parts of the country will understand. ”
“As Putin rears his head and comes into the air space of the United States of America, where– where do they go? It’s Alaska. It’s just right over the border.”
“As for that VP talk all the time, I’ll tell you, I still can’t answer that question until somebody answers for me what is it exactly that the VP does every day?”
” “I’ve been so focused on state government, I haven’t really focused much on the war in Iraq.”

Republicans are kidding, right? And 70% of the GOP would vote her in tomorrow, according to the latest polls. And they want to be taken seriously? ????
44 sdspringy // Jul 27, 2009 at 8:30 pm

Everyone want to state Palin is intellectually weak. But let’s compare her to some Dems, ie.. Biden, now she looks brilliant. Let’s compare her to Pelosi, now she looks really smart and pretty.
Pick a Dem, how about Hilary, rode her hubby into the White House and Senate, couldn’t win the primary, and not allowed to be VP. Compare Hilary to Palin, I would take Palin’s politics.

You noobs on the blog pay way to much attention to the media and Frumm. Palin is coming back, she will be involved in the next 2012 election. The base held their nose and voted for McCain now you progressives will have to hold your nose and vote for Palin.
45 midcon // Jul 27, 2009 at 8:40 pm

sdspringy – I have a news flash for you in case you missed it. Neither the left nor the right decide elections any longer. We independents do and we don’t have to hold our noses and vote any particular way except the way we want to. Now, if you want our vote, you’ll have give us a candidate we can support. And trust me, if you ignore us, you will lose because is not enough of you to win anything at the moment – including dog catcher.
46 sdspringy // Jul 27, 2009 at 8:52 pm

Midcon: I got news for you, keep voting for hope and change. Worked out real good for you so far.
I doubt given the choice to vote for a Obama/Biden ticket in 2012 that any ticket running against them will win. If they offer conservative solutions, not the Dem lite which Frumm pushes.
47 anniemargret // Jul 27, 2009 at 10:00 pm

- Sarah Palin was Wasilla’s mayor for six years, and governor of Alaska for 2 1/2 years, quitting mid-term so she wouldn’t be a “lame duck governor”. She attended five colleges within six years, and got her B.S. in Communications from the Univ of Idaho.

– Joe Biden served as U.S. Senator almost 36 years, re-elected to the Senate six times. He is an attorney. He was chairman of the Foreign Relations Committee. He was also Chairman of the Senate Judiciary Committee.

- Nancy Pelosi was Minority Whip from 2002-03, then Minority leader from 2003-07, and a member of the U.S. house since ‘87 and elected Speaker of the House in ‘07. She graduated from Trinity College and is now the highest-ranking female politician in US history. She comes from a political family, her father being mayor of Baltimore and U.S. Rep.

- Hillary Clinton is the U.S. Sec’y of State. She was a U.S. Senator for 8 years and First Lady for 7 years. She is a Yale-graduate attorney, and served on the editorial board of Yale Review of Law and Social Action. Her career accomplishments (e.g. – legal services for the poor, and advocates of children against abuse) are too numerous to list here.

No contest.
48 anniemargret // Jul 27, 2009 at 10:06 pm

Sdpringy….: Yes, she is ‘intellectually weak.’ And that’s the problem. Republicans are in major denial. But hey, Rove is laughing in his soup, and we Democrats think she is the gift that keeps on giving.
49 sdspringy // Jul 27, 2009 at 10:46 pm

Annie:
Great, the same Biden who wanted the three state solution for Iraq. The same Biden who trips over his tongue more that Ford tripped on his feet. Biden is an idiot, the fact he is still elected says more about the pork he delivers than his abilities. And says alot about the voters from his state.

Pelosi, has failed to deliver on every Dem promise since becoming Speaker in 07. Failed to bring the troops home, instead approved the surge. Failed to stop earmarks, Failed to support ethics in the House, Failed to close Gitmo, Utterly failed on the House Intelligence Committee.

Hilary spouted feminist doctrine yet rode old Bill right into the ground, voted for the war before she voted against it, stood beside Reid and said the war could not be won, then voted for the surge.

All Dems are the same, never have to say your sorry for failed policy, never have to acknowledge the bad voting record, just deliver the pork, and get reelected every time, ie Byrd, Kennedy, Biden.
50 anniemargret // Jul 27, 2009 at 11:03 pm

Yes, Biden has a problem with diarrhea of the mouth, but please don’t kid me about his being an ‘idiot.’ Yes his repeated elections says a lot about his voters, but then again…what does it say about Palin that so many find this woman irresistable when she clearly is out of her league on the national stage?

And let’s be honest here, OK? You say Democrats never say we’re sorry for failed policy, or do not acknowledge bad voting, etc… And when was the last time you, or I, ever heard an apology for the 8 disastrous years of Bush and Cheney, which have now brought us to the lowest point on record in almost every sector concerning our national and international policies? Over 5,000 Americans dead on the streets of Iraq, billions spent, millions ‘lost,’ thousands more maimed for life, innocents killed, and what for? What did we prove there? Where’s the apology for that bill of goods that was sold to us?

Methinks there might be apologies from all sides, no?
51 Chekote // Jul 28, 2009 at 12:12 am

Where’s the apology for that bill of goods that was sold to us?

Today about 31 million Iraqis have the opportunity to be free and chart their own destiny. Today, Iraqi women have equal rights and are serving as inspiration to women all over the Middle East to fight for their own equal rights. There is nothing to apologize for fighting for freedom and human rights.
52 Palin’s Legacy | linkthe.com // Jul 28, 2009 at 2:48 am

[...] this just in, your mom called VN:F [1.5.6_840]please wait…Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast) David Frum: “Sarah Palin’s most notable achievement as governor of Alaska was to increase the [...]
53 barker13 // Jul 28, 2009 at 8:24 am

Re: Midcon // Jul 27, 2009 at 6:36 pm –

“…everyone here is having a Pavlovian response…”

Not “everyone,” Mid. (*SMILE*)

“If you are gonna trash Palin, let’s give equal trashing to people like Dodd.”

(*SNORT*) Hey… I’m with you, Mid – as you know – but how many times have I tried… how many times have you tried…??? (*SHRUG*)

Mid. Check out Frum’s “Pick Up Jaw from Floor, Reinsert in Mouth” thread. Note my comment. You don’t see any follow-ups, do you…???

(*SHRUG*)

BILL
54 barker13 // Jul 28, 2009 at 8:51 am

Re: Sdspringy // Jul 27, 2009 at 8:30 pm –

“You noobs on the blog pay way to much attention to the media and Frum.”

To “defend” the noobs… (*GRIN*)

First of all, I don’t think ANY of us pay all that much attention to Frum.

Second… no… they have their opinions set in advance – they only use the media to supply ammo.

(*SHRUG*)

“Everyone want to state Palin is intellectually weak.”

Everyone who disdains her, you mean, right?

Palin’s OBVIOUSLY not an intellectual. That’s a far cry from being “intellectually weak.” I like Palin but I certainly don’t put her in Gingrich’s league with respect to raw intellect – do you?

But, hey… is intellect everything…??? Does intellect trump everything else? I’d certainly say “no.” Jimmy Carter… intellectual? I’d say so. (*SHRUG*) Woodrow Wilson? Umm… YEAH.

I’d say Palin has a bit of “Truman” in her.

As to Biden… (*FALLING TO THE FLOOR LAUGHING*) Yep. Joe’s not going to be invited to join Mensa anytime soon. (*CHUCKLE*)

“The base held their nose and voted for McCain…”

Well… (*PAUSE*)… that all depends upon how you categorize “the base.” I’m the conservative base who more often than not votes for the GOP candidate, but I voted for Bob Barr this time. (*SHRUG*)

Back in ‘92 Pappy Bush sent folks like me over the Perot. (*SHRUG*)

Hey, Sdspringy, let me ask you… what would you think of a Gingrich-Palin ticket in ‘12? (Just curious.) (Me? I’d support it! Enthusiastically!) (I’d also support Gingrich-Giuliani…)

Re: Midcon // Jul 27, 2009 at 8:40 pm –

Whoa…! Mid…! Take a breath! (*GRIN*) You’re coming across as if you believe YOU represent some sort of unified block of “independents.”

Re: Sdspringy // Jul 27, 2009 at 8:52 pm –

Springy… you too… DOWN! (*LAUGHING*) I don’t believe you need fear that Mid is gonna be supporting Obama-Biden in ‘12. (*GRIN*)

BILL
55 brutus1791 // Jul 28, 2009 at 9:07 am

Well, I am coming into this party unfashionably late. From what I see, this conversation seems to be getting nowhere. Not to the fault of the list-members, Mr. Frum does a poor impression of Socrates here….

Neverhteless, having actually lived in Alaska; yes they do have tax rebates given to the population to try and encourage growth (businesses and inhabitants). It was so long before Palin was in office, and will continue… do you have any idea what the cost of living was?! When Pizza Hut runs an ad and says *Not valid in Hawaii and Alaska* it is because we are paying $22 for a friggin pizza.

Mr. Frum is starting to look like Regina George from “Mean Girls” regarding Palin. Give it a rest…
56 barker13 // Jul 28, 2009 at 9:11 am

Re: Anniemargret // Jul 27, 2009 at 10:00 pm –

You’ve actually stumbled upon the truth! Yes! No contest! I’d take Sarah Palin as POTUS any day of the week over Biden, Pelosi, or Clinton!

(*GRIN*)

Now, Annie… I know you’re a partisan Democrat (and appreciate that you’re up front about it!), but surely you’re not so totally submerged in Kool-Aid that you believe throwing out the names of Joe Biden, Nancy Pelosi, and Hillary Clinton is going to arouse Republicans’ collective “inner lib” to emerge and say, yeah… those are the folks I maintaining and even increasing their power.

(*SNORT*)

Re: Sdspringy // Jul 27, 2009 at 10:46 pm –

“…the three state solution for Iraq.”

Actually, Springy, Biden stumbled upon the right idea there. (Probably for the wrong reasons, but still…) The problem was, this would have had to be the plan from the beginning and the Bush administration just dropped the ball totally on post-”victory” planning.

(Anyway… I digress… perhaps a topic for another thread some day in the future.) (*SMILE*)

Re: Anniemargret // Jul 27, 2009 at 11:03 pm –

“…when was the last time you, or I, ever heard an apology for the 8 disastrous years of Bush and Cheney…”

Annie. Seriously… what meds are you on? Do you rely upon mail order prescriptions?

What a totally asinine statement! Folks like me criticize Bush constantly and did so constantly from his CAMPAIGNING days back in 1999/2000.

What’s that psychiatric term… “Projection…???” Yeah… that’s it. (*SNORT*) You’re “projecting,” Annie.

It was Republican conservatives who fought Bush on expanding medicare/caid prescription drug coverage. It was Republican conservatives who forced Bush to withdraw the Miers nomination. It was Republican conservatives who went ballistic on Bush’s (aborted) ports security deal.

(*SIGH*)

Again… snorting Kool Aid up your nose is unattractive AND painful. STOP IT!

(*ROLLING MY FRIGG’N EYES*)

“Over 5,000 Americans dead on the streets of Iraq, billions spent, millions ‘lost,’ thousands more maimed for life, innocents killed, and what for?”

Not a word about the present? Not a peep about current Obama policies? Not one single word about our accelerating troop losses in Afghanistan…??? (*SIGH*)

Annie… you’re a piece of work.

BILL
57 barker13 // Jul 28, 2009 at 9:17 am

Re: Chekote // Jul 28, 2009 at 12:12 am –

Listen… how many of us would vote “aye” if were were able to go back in time as federal legislators and vote for or against giving Bush carte blanche to invade Iraq?

Not me! I was in favor of the liberation at the time, but we (the Bush administration – much of the blame accruing to Powell’s State Department and Powell’s pet poodle Bremer IMHO) screwed up and to my way of thinking whatever good may come out of it the cost – in lives and treasure – was too great.

But, YES… that aside, of course Chekote is correct. It’s simply asinine to argue that “no good” came out of the Iraq war.

BILL
58 midcon // Jul 28, 2009 at 9:29 am

You mean I don’t represent all the independents? Dang! I had visions of havin a beer in the Oval Office!
59 Chekote // Jul 28, 2009 at 9:31 am

Bill

What is interesting to me is that I am sure that people like Annie are liberal because they believe in human rights, helping the poor and so on. Yet, they cannot see the good in liberating Iraq.
60 Chekote // Jul 28, 2009 at 9:36 am

Well, I have been placed on “soft bans” in a couple of right wing blogs because of my “Palin rants”. This is the kind of nonsense that right wing blogs write about Palin:

sarah palin: role model for conservative women – July 27, 2009
she’s been simply fearless. sarah palin has stood up to the party bullies, the hypocritical and intensely jealous elites, and the blinded, salivating media. she does not apologize for being an american and is a champion of the military in service to this country. without being overly dramatic, she could almost be from american revolutionary or even pioneer times.

Source

Palin QUIT her job and yet she is regarded as fearless. Unbelievable! We have a HUGE problem in the GOP.
61 barker13 // Jul 28, 2009 at 11:41 am

Re: Midcon // Jul 28, 2009 at 9:29 am –

I wonder what beer the Obama White House serves?

BILL
62 Churl // Jul 28, 2009 at 12:16 pm

A better reply to Frum than I have time for:

http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2009/07/27/david-frum-jokes-about-sarah-palin-proves-he-still-doesnt-get-it/
63 brutus1791 // Jul 28, 2009 at 12:53 pm

Bill

Yeungling Black & Tan…
64 barker13 // Jul 28, 2009 at 12:55 pm

Re: Churl // Jul 28, 2009 at 12:16 pm –

Thanks for posting that!

(”The David Sisters…”) (*GRIN*) Gotta luv it!

BILL
65 barker13 // Jul 28, 2009 at 4:31 pm

Re: Brutus1791 // Jul 28, 2009 at 12:53 pm –

Hmm… good choice – politically as well as taste wise.

Yeungling is my favorite “pisswater” domestic beer.

Still… I lay my bet on Goose Island.

(I’ll also place a side bet – a place bet – on “Two Brothers” as the dark horse.)

BILL
66 anniemargret // Jul 28, 2009 at 7:42 pm

I’m a left of center Democrat. previously an Independent. I come from a Eisenhower Republican family. I am liberal but I can agree from time to time with some conservative views, and I always like listening to what the opposition says. …ergo…my visiting this site where I am not sippin any Kool-Aid (no thanks to your adolescent ad hominem attacks, snortin Bill) to think I will ‘win’ any argument on THIS site!

Do I think that some Iraqis are grateful for the removal of that petty tyrant, Saddam? Sure. But when you weigh the unfathomable costs to this war? No. He was no imminent threat, regardless how Cheney tried to sell that one itty bitty lie. You really don’t think ALL of us were duped by the ‘he’s-about-to-nuke-us’ fear mongering, do you? The costs of this war will be felt for years to come. They reported on a soldier tonight who killed himself due to lack of attention to his ‘brain disintegrating’ from the bombs. Head wound injuries and psychological problems will be a nightmare for these returning soldiers and their families.

The cost of Iraq is too high, too high. No geopolitical move on our part will even out the terrible costs of this war.

If Bush had put the resources in Afghanistan from the get-go, we might have made a dent there- baggged Bin Laden, and lessened the curse of the Taliban, instead of now having to increase troop levels in Afghanistan. He diverted those Afghanistan funds to Iraq, remember?

Back to Palin. Just heard Colin Powell call her ‘fascinating’…. yeah, fascinating. No one on this site with any honesty is going to say she is in the same league as Reagan, senior Bush, Einsenhower. She’s a quitter! Fearless, they say. The only thing she is fearless about is knocking down anyone standing in her way to deposit her megabucks at the bank.
67 brutus1791 // Jul 29, 2009 at 8:09 am

Re: barker13 // Jul 28, 2009 at 4:31 pm

Bill, I found subtle comedic value in my original post… delightfully tacky, yet unrefined. I, myself, will have Shiner Bock on tap…
68 barker13 // Jul 29, 2009 at 8:39 am

Re: Anniemargret // Jul 28, 2009 at 7:42 pm –

“I’m a left of center Democrat, previously an Independent.”

(*SNORT*)

Hmm… would that happen to translate to “I’m a left of center Democrat, previously a left of center Independent?

Anne…. sweetee… were you deliberately mixing apples and oranges or do you not understand that one is a “team” identifier while the other is an ideological identifer?

Or… do you simply shed ideologies the way others shed stained garments?

“I am liberal…”

(*CHUCKLE*) Yes. Usually when one thinks “left of center Democrat” one thinks… er… “liberal.”

“I am not sippin any Kool-Aid (no thanks to your adolescent ad hominem attacks, snortin Bill) to think I will ‘win’ any argument on THIS site! ”

(*LAUGHING OUT LOUD*) Oh, yeah… you’re on a roll already! (*ROLLING MY EYES IN AMUSEMENT*)

“Do I think that some Iraqis are grateful for the removal of that petty tyrant, Saddam? Sure. But when you weigh the unfathomable costs to this war? No.”

OK. (*TOLERANT SMILE*) You’re doing it again – mixing two distinct issues. Either “some” Iraqis (actually it’s a hell of a lot more than some – no doubt it’s most) are grateful for the removal of Saddam OR they’re not. (*SHRUG*) Whether the “unfathomable” (actually the stats ARE available, along with analysis of the intangibles) costs of the war were worth it for the United States… that’s another question. (My view? No. They weren’t.)

“…instead of now having to increase troop levels in Afghanistan.”

So skipping right down to your bottom line, you support Obama’s Afghanistan policies… correct?

(*SHRUG*)

Me? I view Afghanistan as a quagmire. (*SNORT*) (Yeah… the irony, huh?)

As to your parting shot at Palin…

(*YAWN*)

BILL
69 Palin’s Legacy | GroupHelp.NET - Easy everything! // Aug 24, 2009 at 1:31 am

[...] Legacy Posted by admin, under Political David Frum: “Sarah Palin’s most notable achievement as governor of Alaska was to increase the payout from the [...]