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	<title>Comments on: Or Else What?</title>
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	<description>Building a conservatism that can win again</description>
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		<title>By: HHomer</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/or-else-what/comment-page-1#comment-47849</link>
		<dc:creator>HHomer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 May 2009 10:33:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-47849</guid>
		<description>John is quite right, the West has no levers on North Korea.  They already know that any act of aggression would lead to their annihilation.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;This being the case the best option is for the western powers to ignore the regime altogether.  Pass the problem and the burden of food/fuel aid to China.  They  can take a firmer line with Kim Jong Il than the US or anyone else.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;The situation with Iran is quite different because pre-emptive military action remains an option.  </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John is quite right, the West has no levers on North Korea.  They already know that any act of aggression would lead to their annihilation.This being the case the best option is for the western powers to ignore the regime altogether.  Pass the problem and the burden of food/fuel aid to China.  They  can take a firmer line with Kim Jong Il than the US or anyone else.The situation with Iran is quite different because pre-emptive military action remains an option.</p>
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		<title>By: Bulldoglover100</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/or-else-what/comment-page-1#comment-43569</link>
		<dc:creator>Bulldoglover100</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 May 2009 09:14:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-43569</guid>
		<description>All good points. You did leave out though that GWB let them get away with this for 8 years and now Obama is letting them do the same thing....kinda makes the finger pointing look stupid.&lt;br&gt;IF there had been an easy answer GWB would have found it one would think. You offer none yourself other than to attempt to use this as a wedge issue....when our party is just as guilty as the Dems....when will people like you learn???&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;See the new poll out today? Powell enjoys a 70% favorable rating while Cheney is at 30% and Limpball is at 37%....and our party wants to run off the only person probably capable of beating Obama in a National election....LOL NO wonder were are losing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All good points. You did leave out though that GWB let them get away with this for 8 years and now Obama is letting them do the same thing&#8230;.kinda makes the finger pointing look stupid.IF there had been an easy answer GWB would have found it one would think. You offer none yourself other than to attempt to use this as a wedge issue&#8230;.when our party is just as guilty as the Dems&#8230;.when will people like you learn???See the new poll out today? Powell enjoys a 70% favorable rating while Cheney is at 30% and Limpball is at 37%&#8230;.and our party wants to run off the only person probably capable of beating Obama in a National election&#8230;.LOL NO wonder were are losing.</p>
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		<title>By: Egli Ha</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/or-else-what/comment-page-1#comment-44862</link>
		<dc:creator>Egli Ha</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 May 2009 06:07:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-44862</guid>
		<description>And what sort of &quot;action&quot; do you have in mind???  Kill a lot of North Koreans?  Isn&#039;t that what the Dear Leader is already doing?  Invade North Korea?  What would the troops eat?&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;And why shouldn&#039;t this be a multi-lateral issue?  Is the USA the only one threatened by NKorea?&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I know!  Let send John McCain to take care of it.  Parachute him right on in.  Or just give him a plane and instruct him to fly OVER NKorea, and wait for him to crash.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And what sort of &#8220;action&#8221; do you have in mind???  Kill a lot of North Koreans?  Isn&#8217;t that what the Dear Leader is already doing?  Invade North Korea?  What would the troops eat?And why shouldn&#8217;t this be a multi-lateral issue?  Is the USA the only one threatened by NKorea?I know!  Let send John McCain to take care of it.  Parachute him right on in.  Or just give him a plane and instruct him to fly OVER NKorea, and wait for him to crash.</p>
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		<title>By: Publius</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/or-else-what/comment-page-1#comment-54910</link>
		<dc:creator>Publius</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 May 2009 00:11:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-54910</guid>
		<description>The limits the Obama administration is accepting are, in fact, the identical limits the Bush XLIII administration accepted. In point of fact, they are the limits that administration claimed as strengths in 2004 when adherence to the six-power formula in Korea was excoriated by the Democrats as ignoring a clear and present danger. The then Bush administration claimed them as evidence of coalition building and mutuality of interest.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;This is an issue on which the Chinese can safely be counted upon to carry our, and the rest of the world&#039;s, water.  They have the military, on the ground, and the well demonstrated ability to ignore world opinion and quash domestic opinion.  They also have a bottled-in-bond interest in plugging the dyke.  Surely one of the great nightmares in Beijing is the recognition that North Korea will, in due course of time, follow East Germany into a reunion with its western capitalist other half.  North Korea with the bomb and its inept economy may be one thing.  A unified Korea with North Korean plutonium and South Korean productive capacity is another entirely.  &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;It is unlikely that North Korea will long survive the demise of Kim Jong-il.  Long before that time, China will step in.  They seek regional leadership, they seek global leadership, this is the right thing for them to do and they know it.  This is one fight the U.S. can rightly sidestep.  Can we really afford to be embroiled in yet a third  ground war in Asia?  All sanctions, postures, pressures and the like are all designed to suggest that compliance with accepted norms is required &#039;or else.&#039;  We no longer have an &#039;or else&#039; the world is prepared to accept.  There is no surgical solution.  Quiet strangulation of this particular hernia is the sensible solution.&lt;br&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The limits the Obama administration is accepting are, in fact, the identical limits the Bush XLIII administration accepted. In point of fact, they are the limits that administration claimed as strengths in 2004 when adherence to the six-power formula in Korea was excoriated by the Democrats as ignoring a clear and present danger. The then Bush administration claimed them as evidence of coalition building and mutuality of interest.This is an issue on which the Chinese can safely be counted upon to carry our, and the rest of the world&#8217;s, water.  They have the military, on the ground, and the well demonstrated ability to ignore world opinion and quash domestic opinion.  They also have a bottled-in-bond interest in plugging the dyke.  Surely one of the great nightmares in Beijing is the recognition that North Korea will, in due course of time, follow East Germany into a reunion with its western capitalist other half.  North Korea with the bomb and its inept economy may be one thing.  A unified Korea with North Korean plutonium and South Korean productive capacity is another entirely.  It is unlikely that North Korea will long survive the demise of Kim Jong-il.  Long before that time, China will step in.  They seek regional leadership, they seek global leadership, this is the right thing for them to do and they know it.  This is one fight the U.S. can rightly sidestep.  Can we really afford to be embroiled in yet a third  ground war in Asia?  All sanctions, postures, pressures and the like are all designed to suggest that compliance with accepted norms is required &#8216;or else.&#8217;  We no longer have an &#8216;or else&#8217; the world is prepared to accept.  There is no surgical solution.  Quiet strangulation of this particular hernia is the sensible solution.</p>
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