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	<title>Comments on: Obama&#8217;s Worst</title>
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	<description>Building a conservatism that can win again</description>
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		<title>By: SFTor1</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/obamas-worst/comment-page-2#comment-70956</link>
		<dc:creator>SFTor1</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 21:09:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=14858#comment-70956</guid>
		<description>Sinz says: &quot;I’m still waiting to hear the great liberal plan for how we put al-Qaeda out of business.&quot;

We&#039;re on a better track, that&#039;s for sure. The Bush Administration ignored the warnings from Clinton&#039;s people regarding al-Qaeda. 9/11 followed. It seems like everyone has learned that lesson.

LFC&#039;s analysis seems pretty fair. Multi-pronged intelligence and police efforts, including collaboration with Moslem countries.

It&#039;s the best we&#039;ve got, and I wholeheartedly endorse the sentiment that occupying Moslem countries will make things worse and not better.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sinz says: &#8220;I’m still waiting to hear the great liberal plan for how we put al-Qaeda out of business.&#8221;</p>
<p>We&#8217;re on a better track, that&#8217;s for sure. The Bush Administration ignored the warnings from Clinton&#8217;s people regarding al-Qaeda. 9/11 followed. It seems like everyone has learned that lesson.</p>
<p>LFC&#8217;s analysis seems pretty fair. Multi-pronged intelligence and police efforts, including collaboration with Moslem countries.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s the best we&#8217;ve got, and I wholeheartedly endorse the sentiment that occupying Moslem countries will make things worse and not better.</p>
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		<title>By: LFC</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/obamas-worst/comment-page-2#comment-70913</link>
		<dc:creator>LFC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 15:47:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=14858#comment-70913</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;sinz54 said...And so we’re going to be attacked again. Big-time. Until and unless the famous liberal plan for dealing with al-Qaeda is put into effect.&lt;/i&gt;

&lt;i&gt;What is it?&lt;/i&gt;

Well it ain&#039;t invasion of one country after another and it ain&#039;t torture of innocent people to extract false confessions and bad intelligence.  It IS the FBI and CIA.  It&#039;s the NSA.  It&#039;s local and state police.  It is not a multi-decade occupation by our military in Muslim nations that view us as an enemy.

Bush never claimed he&#039;d be able to meet that standard.  Nor Cheney.  Nor Petraues.  Nor Obama.  And there&#039;s a reason for that.  It&#039;s because it&#039;s not possible.  You demand a silver bullet that will prevent any terrorist attack from ever occurring again.  You want AQ, a now highly de-centralized organization across multiple nations, to be 100% &quot;out of action&quot;.  That&#039;s a child&#039;s demand, but adults have to face the reality that this will never happen.  Ask Israel what the magic bullet is to stop all terrorist attacks.

The WTC was taken down by a handful of fanatics with box cutters.  Timothy McVeigh, pretty much alone, used fertilizer and auto fuel to killed 168, wound many more, and cause enormous damage.  The U.S.S. Cole was struck by a small speedboat operated by suicidal maniacs.  And you demand that we make it so this could never happen again?  Dream on.

&quot;You can&#039;t handle the truth. Because the truth is, I blew up the Murrah Building and isn&#039;t it kind of scary that one man could wreak this kind of hell?&quot;  -- Timothy McVeight</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>sinz54 said&#8230;And so we’re going to be attacked again. Big-time. Until and unless the famous liberal plan for dealing with al-Qaeda is put into effect.</p>
<p>What is it?</p>
<p>Well it ain&#8217;t invasion of one country after another and it ain&#8217;t torture of innocent people to extract false confessions and bad intelligence.  It IS the FBI and CIA.  It&#8217;s the NSA.  It&#8217;s local and state police.  It is not a multi-decade occupation by our military in Muslim nations that view us as an enemy.</p>
<p>Bush never claimed he&#8217;d be able to meet that standard.  Nor Cheney.  Nor Petraues.  Nor Obama.  And there&#8217;s a reason for that.  It&#8217;s because it&#8217;s not possible.  You demand a silver bullet that will prevent any terrorist attack from ever occurring again.  You want AQ, a now highly de-centralized organization across multiple nations, to be 100% &#8220;out of action&#8221;.  That&#8217;s a child&#8217;s demand, but adults have to face the reality that this will never happen.  Ask Israel what the magic bullet is to stop all terrorist attacks.</p>
<p>The WTC was taken down by a handful of fanatics with box cutters.  Timothy McVeigh, pretty much alone, used fertilizer and auto fuel to killed 168, wound many more, and cause enormous damage.  The U.S.S. Cole was struck by a small speedboat operated by suicidal maniacs.  And you demand that we make it so this could never happen again?  Dream on.</p>
<p>&#8220;You can&#8217;t handle the truth. Because the truth is, I blew up the Murrah Building and isn&#8217;t it kind of scary that one man could wreak this kind of hell?&#8221;  &#8212; Timothy McVeight</p>
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		<title>By: sinz54</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/obamas-worst/comment-page-2#comment-70881</link>
		<dc:creator>sinz54</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 14:07:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=14858#comment-70881</guid>
		<description>sftor1: &lt;blockquote&gt; Train some more Afghan military and police, declare victory and get out. &lt;/blockquote&gt;
I&#039;m still waiting to hear the great liberal plan for how we put al-Qaeda out of business.

If you surf over to the FBI and CIA websites, they tell you that they are continuing to break up one al-Qaeda plot after another.  But they can&#039;t hope to have a perfect track record.  Sooner or later, they&#039;re going to miss one.

And so we&#039;re going to be attacked again.  Big-time.  Until and unless the famous liberal plan for dealing with al-Qaeda is put into effect.

What is it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>sftor1:  Train some more Afghan military and police, declare victory and get out.<br />
I&#8217;m still waiting to hear the great liberal plan for how we put al-Qaeda out of business.</p>
<p>If you surf over to the FBI and CIA websites, they tell you that they are continuing to break up one al-Qaeda plot after another.  But they can&#8217;t hope to have a perfect track record.  Sooner or later, they&#8217;re going to miss one.</p>
<p>And so we&#8217;re going to be attacked again.  Big-time.  Until and unless the famous liberal plan for dealing with al-Qaeda is put into effect.</p>
<p>What is it?</p>
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		<title>By: ottovbvs</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/obamas-worst/comment-page-2#comment-70868</link>
		<dc:creator>ottovbvs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 13:46:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=14858#comment-70868</guid>
		<description>.....We&#039;ve been in Afghanistan for eight years, eight years, for just over seven of them management of the situation there was in the hands of the Bush administration who dawdled away whatever remote chance we had of ever straightening this place out.........this was twice as long as US participation in WW 2........Now Frum is running around trying pin the blame for sorting out a huge national liability on a president who has been in office for ten months.......it&#039;s pathetic and blows a bit of a hole in his oft expressed desire to see the Republican party revert back to being seen as a responsible party of governance.......to be seen as a responsible party of governance you have to talk like one.........we&#039;re playing with the lives of thousand of American lives here so it merits something beyond 8th grade puerilities.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8230;..We&#8217;ve been in Afghanistan for eight years, eight years, for just over seven of them management of the situation there was in the hands of the Bush administration who dawdled away whatever remote chance we had of ever straightening this place out&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;this was twice as long as US participation in WW 2&#8230;&#8230;..Now Frum is running around trying pin the blame for sorting out a huge national liability on a president who has been in office for ten months&#8230;&#8230;.it&#8217;s pathetic and blows a bit of a hole in his oft expressed desire to see the Republican party revert back to being seen as a responsible party of governance&#8230;&#8230;.to be seen as a responsible party of governance you have to talk like one&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;we&#8217;re playing with the lives of thousand of American lives here so it merits something beyond 8th grade puerilities.</p>
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		<title>By: johnmarzan</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/obamas-worst/comment-page-2#comment-70843</link>
		<dc:creator>johnmarzan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 11:31:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=14858#comment-70843</guid>
		<description>obama mismanaged relations with karzai because he was against him from the start and wanted him out from the getgo.

http://bit.ly/BcOv 

http://bit.ly/1XxFyw 
http://bit.ly/8Iblq 
http://bit.ly/1tLqPE 
http://bit.ly/1FGmzv 
http://bit.ly/vt0TP</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>obama mismanaged relations with karzai because he was against him from the start and wanted him out from the getgo.</p>
<p><a href="http://bit.ly/BcOv" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/BcOv</a> </p>
<p><a href="http://bit.ly/1XxFyw" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/1XxFyw</a><br />
<a href="http://bit.ly/8Iblq" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/8Iblq</a><br />
<a href="http://bit.ly/1tLqPE" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/1tLqPE</a><br />
<a href="http://bit.ly/1FGmzv" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/1FGmzv</a><br />
<a href="http://bit.ly/vt0TP" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/vt0TP</a></p>
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		<title>By: SFTor1</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/obamas-worst/comment-page-2#comment-70827</link>
		<dc:creator>SFTor1</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 04:02:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=14858#comment-70827</guid>
		<description>Back-of-the envelope analysis: an unmanageable area that is a country in name only. A head of state that is a corrupt crony of the West (former UNOCAL consultant for the pipeline deal.) A nationalist opponent with infinite patience, fueled by religious fervor. A military operation once labeled a police action that has turned into an eight year occupation with no end in sight, neither in time to end game nor in human and material resources required. A people that is increasingly turning against the occupier. Being in the middle of a regional showdown between India and Pakistan.

The Administration has serious qualms about continuing this loser, as they well should. Train some more Afghan military and police, declare victory and get out.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Back-of-the envelope analysis: an unmanageable area that is a country in name only. A head of state that is a corrupt crony of the West (former UNOCAL consultant for the pipeline deal.) A nationalist opponent with infinite patience, fueled by religious fervor. A military operation once labeled a police action that has turned into an eight year occupation with no end in sight, neither in time to end game nor in human and material resources required. A people that is increasingly turning against the occupier. Being in the middle of a regional showdown between India and Pakistan.</p>
<p>The Administration has serious qualms about continuing this loser, as they well should. Train some more Afghan military and police, declare victory and get out.</p>
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		<title>By: balconesfault</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/obamas-worst/comment-page-2#comment-70822</link>
		<dc:creator>balconesfault</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 03:00:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=14858#comment-70822</guid>
		<description>hey Mr. Abuse, I was asking how it is that Independent has already concluded that Pakistan is not included in the equation.  Seems to me that, for example, Obama authorizing drone strikes of Al Qaeda emplacements in Pakistan shows that in fact he is including the destruction of Al Qaeda in Pakistan as part of the solution, and not just driving Al Qaeda from Afghanistan.

I really think you guys are incapable of reading for comprehension sometimes.  If you don&#039;t understand what someone is talking about, how about you ask, like I did, rather than just jumping on the abuse wagon right away?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>hey Mr. Abuse, I was asking how it is that Independent has already concluded that Pakistan is not included in the equation.  Seems to me that, for example, Obama authorizing drone strikes of Al Qaeda emplacements in Pakistan shows that in fact he is including the destruction of Al Qaeda in Pakistan as part of the solution, and not just driving Al Qaeda from Afghanistan.</p>
<p>I really think you guys are incapable of reading for comprehension sometimes.  If you don&#8217;t understand what someone is talking about, how about you ask, like I did, rather than just jumping on the abuse wagon right away?</p>
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		<title>By: MI-GOPer</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/obamas-worst/comment-page-2#comment-70821</link>
		<dc:creator>MI-GOPer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 02:37:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=14858#comment-70821</guid>
		<description>by the way Independent, we&#039;ve found BlankHead to be routinely disingenious and intellectually dishonest.  It&#039;s a crack-up that you pegged him so accurately, so fast.

Kudos.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>by the way Independent, we&#8217;ve found BlankHead to be routinely disingenious and intellectually dishonest.  It&#8217;s a crack-up that you pegged him so accurately, so fast.</p>
<p>Kudos.</p>
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		<title>By: MI-GOPer</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/obamas-worst/comment-page-2#comment-70818</link>
		<dc:creator>MI-GOPer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 02:13:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=14858#comment-70818</guid>
		<description>BlankHead asks a commenter: &quot;I’m trying to figure out how Obama has not included Pakistan in his equations. Enlighten, please&quot;.

I think the commenter has already tried to enlighten you, BlankHead.  What part of &quot;... a comprehensive new strategy that included pakistan in the equation of a solution. (H)is words as president were consistent with his campaign promises made to gain the nomination and win the election&quot; not clear to you.

And how can you, BlankHead, read that and surmise the writer excluded Pakistan?  You&#039;re that quick to replace AutomaticBS as the FrumForum Village Idiot??</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>BlankHead asks a commenter: &#8220;I’m trying to figure out how Obama has not included Pakistan in his equations. Enlighten, please&#8221;.</p>
<p>I think the commenter has already tried to enlighten you, BlankHead.  What part of &#8220;&#8230; a comprehensive new strategy that included pakistan in the equation of a solution. (H)is words as president were consistent with his campaign promises made to gain the nomination and win the election&#8221; not clear to you.</p>
<p>And how can you, BlankHead, read that and surmise the writer excluded Pakistan?  You&#8217;re that quick to replace AutomaticBS as the FrumForum Village Idiot??</p>
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		<title>By: SpartacusIsNotDead</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/obamas-worst/comment-page-1#comment-70816</link>
		<dc:creator>SpartacusIsNotDead</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Nov 2009 23:47:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=14858#comment-70816</guid>
		<description>Before anyone complains that there aren&#039;t enough troops in Afghanistan, they should first deal with the two erroneous premises Reason60 pointed out:

1. That we can create a stable civil democracy in a nation that has no history or desire for one.
2. This is needed to prevent future terrorists from having a safe haven in which to plot there attacks. 

Then, you have to define what &quot;winning the war&quot; actually means.  If it means kicking Al Qaeda out of Afghanistan, then we&#039;ve already won.  If it means preventing a return of Al Qaeda to Afghanistan, then this costs too much and it doesn&#039;t increase our security since Al Qaeda can simply operate from Pakistan or any other ungoverned land.

After defining what &quot;winning the war&quot; actually means, then you have to decide whether the best way to do that is by adding more troops.

Frum and others who have criticized Obama&#039;s delay in adding more trips have failed to address these more fundamental concerns.  By not addressing these larger concerns, their criticisms seem like nothing more than partisan complaints.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Before anyone complains that there aren&#8217;t enough troops in Afghanistan, they should first deal with the two erroneous premises Reason60 pointed out:</p>
<p>1. That we can create a stable civil democracy in a nation that has no history or desire for one.<br />
2. This is needed to prevent future terrorists from having a safe haven in which to plot there attacks. </p>
<p>Then, you have to define what &#8220;winning the war&#8221; actually means.  If it means kicking Al Qaeda out of Afghanistan, then we&#8217;ve already won.  If it means preventing a return of Al Qaeda to Afghanistan, then this costs too much and it doesn&#8217;t increase our security since Al Qaeda can simply operate from Pakistan or any other ungoverned land.</p>
<p>After defining what &#8220;winning the war&#8221; actually means, then you have to decide whether the best way to do that is by adding more troops.</p>
<p>Frum and others who have criticized Obama&#8217;s delay in adding more trips have failed to address these more fundamental concerns.  By not addressing these larger concerns, their criticisms seem like nothing more than partisan complaints.</p>
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