Comments on: Losing The Military Vote http://www.frumforum.com/losing-the-military-vote Building a conservatism that can win again Sat, 11 Feb 2012 17:50:44 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Do people in the military overwhelmingly support Republicans? - Politics and Other Controversies - Page 2 - City-Data Forum http://www.frumforum.com/losing-the-military-vote/comment-page-1#comment-64304 Do people in the military overwhelmingly support Republicans? - Politics and Other Controversies - Page 2 - City-Data Forum Sat, 12 Sep 2009 20:23:18 +0000 #comment-64304 [...] Losing The Military Vote Quote: [...] [...] Losing The Military Vote Quote: [...]

]]> By: GeneK http://www.frumforum.com/losing-the-military-vote/comment-page-1#comment-41951 GeneK Fri, 23 Jan 2009 17:37:36 +0000 #comment-41951 You've got it wrong senorlechero. The retirees I've talked to that voted for Obama mentioned the reasons that Sarah did in the article. The Obama canvasser that came to my door who was on active duty (not in uniform) said similar things in encourageing me to vote for Obama. Why are there more vets running for public office as Democrats? Think about it a little. We suffered embarrassing election defeats the last two cycles--this trend is not our friend. A lot of work needs to be done fast--but continueing to do what we've done in the past is unlikely to produce a different result. You’ve got it wrong senorlechero. The retirees I’ve talked to that voted for Obama mentioned the reasons that Sarah did in the article. The Obama canvasser that came to my door who was on active duty (not in uniform) said similar things in encourageing me to vote for Obama. Why are there more vets running for public office as Democrats? Think about it a little. We suffered embarrassing election defeats the last two cycles–this trend is not our friend. A lot of work needs to be done fast–but continueing to do what we’ve done in the past is unlikely to produce a different result.

]]> By: senorlechero http://www.frumforum.com/losing-the-military-vote/comment-page-1#comment-41556 senorlechero Fri, 23 Jan 2009 01:51:13 +0000 #comment-41556 GeneK...you are wrong if you think anyone who voted for Obama believes he supports the military more than any republican candidate. The left voted for him because they hate the military and hope he does too. More moderates voted for him than McCain because they saw McCain as too much like Bush and as part of the administration they blame for the nations financial problems. You have no reason to believe me, but I'll say it anyway. I know a great many military members. None that I know supported Obama. None of them believe he will give them what they need to do their job. None of them believe he will help their families or provide them with better benefits. This woman's post is pure Democrat propaganda . Nothing you have said supports it in any way except to say that you agree with it. GeneK…you are wrong if you think anyone who voted for Obama believes he supports the military more than any republican candidate. The left voted for him because they hate the military and hope he does too. More moderates voted for him than McCain because they saw McCain as too much like Bush and as part of the administration they blame for the nations financial problems.

You have no reason to believe me, but I’ll say it anyway. I know a great many military members. None that I know supported Obama. None of them believe he will give them what they need to do their job. None of them believe he will help their families or provide them with better benefits.

This woman’s post is pure Democrat propaganda . Nothing you have said supports it in any way except to say that you agree with it.

]]> By: GeneK http://www.frumforum.com/losing-the-military-vote/comment-page-1#comment-54950 GeneK Thu, 22 Jan 2009 23:05:22 +0000 #comment-54950 I want to win elections senorlechero, not pontificate from the wilderness. Take a hard look at what's happening. Congresswoman Drake (R-VA) lost her seat to a novice weak democrat in the Hampton Roads district that Obama won---this was a safe Republican seat. In my state senatorial district a moderate Republican lost to a further right candidate in the primary. In the general election the Democrat won and with it the Republican majority in the VA state senate was lost. They (Democratic controlled state Senate) will redistrict after the next census. In the name of party purity we gained nothing and potentially may lose a seat due to redistricting. Our message needs to be focused to attract the voters who voted for Obama--my purpose here is to win elections not give voice to meaningless generalities that may fire up the base but doesn't attract the voters we've lost. I want to win elections senorlechero, not pontificate from the wilderness. Take a hard look at what’s happening. Congresswoman Drake (R-VA) lost her seat to a novice weak democrat in the Hampton Roads district that Obama won—this was a safe Republican seat. In my state senatorial district a moderate Republican lost to a further right candidate in the primary. In the general election the Democrat won and with it the Republican majority in the VA state senate was lost. They (Democratic controlled state Senate) will redistrict after the next census. In the name of party purity we gained nothing and potentially may lose a seat due to redistricting. Our message needs to be focused to attract the voters who voted for Obama–my purpose here is to win elections not give voice to meaningless generalities that may fire up the base but doesn’t attract the voters we’ve lost.

]]> By: senorlechero http://www.frumforum.com/losing-the-military-vote/comment-page-1#comment-49016 senorlechero Thu, 22 Jan 2009 19:07:30 +0000 #comment-49016 MarkG555, you are 100% correct. Folks like GeneK crack me up making stuff up likie "Obama would not have carried this area if he had not recieved the support of a significant number of military spouses and retirees" in attempts to get conservatives to change their beliefs. GeneK....Obama has said alot of things. So what? What Obama says has no bearing on what conservatives and Republicans should have as their core beliefs. We are for a strong national defense, which includes a strong military and giving the military the tools to do the job. Democrats are not. As for "the political ground", well, it is always shifting. and it will be different by the next election. When Obama's Gitmo Detainees are releases on American soil the ground will have "shifted" a great deal. My guess is that when that happens, and it will happen, Obama will be unelectable. MarkG555, you are 100% correct. Folks like GeneK crack me up making stuff up likie “Obama would not have carried this area if he had not recieved the support of a significant number of military spouses and retirees” in attempts to get conservatives to change their beliefs.

GeneK….Obama has said alot of things. So what? What Obama says has no bearing on what conservatives and Republicans should have as their core beliefs. We are for a strong national defense, which includes a strong military and giving the military the tools to do the job. Democrats are not.

As for “the political ground”, well, it is always shifting. and it will be different by the next election. When Obama’s Gitmo Detainees are releases on American soil the ground will have “shifted” a great deal. My guess is that when that happens, and it will happen, Obama will be unelectable.

]]> By: MarkG555 http://www.frumforum.com/losing-the-military-vote/comment-page-1#comment-38767 MarkG555 Thu, 22 Jan 2009 15:01:35 +0000 #comment-38767 The whole premise of this article is that Obama got more votes than McCain from active duty military members. I would bet money that's not true. A few minutes of Googling turns up exit polling showing that McCain won among voters who ever served in the military. And 60% of active duty personnel have qualms about President Obama: http://news.aol.com/political-machine/tag/polls/ I hasten to add, in my view we either need a much larger army, or a more isolationist foreign policy. We have asked more than we should of our folks in uniform. The whole premise of this article is that Obama got more votes than McCain from active duty military members. I would bet money that’s not true. A few minutes of Googling turns up exit polling showing that McCain won among voters who ever served in the military. And 60% of active duty personnel have qualms about President Obama: http://news.aol.com/political-machine/tag/polls/

I hasten to add, in my view we either need a much larger army, or a more isolationist foreign policy. We have asked more than we should of our folks in uniform.

]]> By: GeneK http://www.frumforum.com/losing-the-military-vote/comment-page-1#comment-50195 GeneK Thu, 22 Jan 2009 11:41:34 +0000 #comment-50195 I live in the Hampton roads area of Virginia which has a significant active duty and retired military population. Obama would not have carried this area if he had not recieved the support of a significant number of military spouses and retirees. So I think it's appropriate to take a serious look at what can be done to change that outcome. In his inaugral address Obama stated that the ground has shifted--I think that is a valid assessment. I live in the Hampton roads area of Virginia which has a significant active duty and retired military population. Obama would not have carried this area if he had not recieved the support of a significant number of military spouses and retirees. So I think it’s appropriate to take a serious look at what can be done to change that outcome. In his inaugral address Obama stated that the ground has shifted–I think that is a valid assessment.

]]> By: JJWFromME http://www.frumforum.com/losing-the-military-vote/comment-page-1#comment-54514 JJWFromME Thu, 22 Jan 2009 00:02:09 +0000 #comment-54514 I'd say McCain was the best candidate, because he was the only one who could, as a "maverick" and "reformer," credibly dissent from George Bush. The rest of them would have had a lot harder time. George Bush has had consistently had the lowest approval ratings since Richard Nixon (25-20%). So the Republican candidate had a hard task. He had to excite the base (as candidates were doing during the primary debates--see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NhRhDtfYo0 ) among whom George Bush had a high approval rating, and also appeal to the rest of the country, among whom George Bush had a dismally low approval rating. How do you do one without completely turning off the other? Very hard to do. The base: loved George Bush and wanted more more more!! The rest of the country: had had enough, and many thought they had been hoodwinked into going to war. It's very hard to please one of these constituencies without it being the kiss of death for the other. You have to tack to the hard hard right (see the video above) and then tack furiously to the center and pretend that you never played to the base earlier in the year. I’d say McCain was the best candidate, because he was the only one who could, as a “maverick” and “reformer,” credibly dissent from George Bush. The rest of them would have had a lot harder time. George Bush has had consistently had the lowest approval ratings since Richard Nixon (25-20%). So the Republican candidate had a hard task. He had to excite the base (as candidates were doing during the primary debates–see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NhRhDtfYo0 ) among whom George Bush had a high approval rating, and also appeal to the rest of the country, among whom George Bush had a dismally low approval rating. How do you do one without completely turning off the other? Very hard to do. The base: loved George Bush and wanted more more more!! The rest of the country: had had enough, and many thought they had been hoodwinked into going to war. It’s very hard to please one of these constituencies without it being the kiss of death for the other. You have to tack to the hard hard right (see the video above) and then tack furiously to the center and pretend that you never played to the base earlier in the year.

]]> By: sinz54 http://www.frumforum.com/losing-the-military-vote/comment-page-1#comment-43121 sinz54 Wed, 21 Jan 2009 22:42:51 +0000 #comment-43121 JJWfromME: McCain sewed up the GOP nomination by the spring of 2008, mostly on his staunch support for the War on Terror and for his advocacy of a surge in Iraq having been proven right. Those were big issues back then. The problem is that in the following months, the economy totally supplanted the Iraq War as the biggest issue for the electorate. Had the economy, not the Iraq War, been the biggest issue for the entire period 2007-2008, either Romney or Giuliani would have been nominated by the GOP, not McCain. And in the general election, either one of them could have put forward a more credible economic platform than McCain did. JJWfromME: McCain sewed up the GOP nomination by the spring of 2008, mostly on his staunch support for the War on Terror and for his advocacy of a surge in Iraq having been proven right. Those were big issues back then. The problem is that in the following months, the economy totally supplanted the Iraq War as the biggest issue for the electorate. Had the economy, not the Iraq War, been the biggest issue for the entire period 2007-2008, either Romney or Giuliani would have been nominated by the GOP, not McCain. And in the general election, either one of them could have put forward a more credible economic platform than McCain did.

]]> By: sinz54 http://www.frumforum.com/losing-the-military-vote/comment-page-1#comment-39634 sinz54 Wed, 21 Jan 2009 22:37:26 +0000 #comment-39634 Our men and women in the enlisted ranks of the military aren't paid like Wall Street financiers. They and their families have difficulty making ends meet like any other working-class Americans. So in this year of economic collapse, it's not at all surprising that they would vote for the candidate who seemed to promise a genuine economic turnaround. McCain's problem was not his sincerity, his patriotism, his support for the military. His problem was that he came off as clueless as to how to restore American prosperity. That turned off all working families, whether the breadwinners are civilians or soldiers. Our men and women in the enlisted ranks of the military aren’t paid like Wall Street financiers. They and their families have difficulty making ends meet like any other working-class Americans.

So in this year of economic collapse, it’s not at all surprising that they would vote for the candidate who seemed to promise a genuine economic turnaround.

McCain’s problem was not his sincerity, his patriotism, his support for the military. His problem was that he came off as clueless as to how to restore American prosperity. That turned off all working families, whether the breadwinners are civilians or soldiers.

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