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	<title>Comments on: Latimer: Aides Pretended to be Stupid to Get on Bush&#8217;s Good Side</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.frumforum.com/latimer-aides-pretended-to-be-stupid-to-get-on-bushs-good-side/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.frumforum.com/latimer-aides-pretended-to-be-stupid-to-get-on-bushs-good-side</link>
	<description>Building a conservatism that can win again</description>
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		<title>By: Jim</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/latimer-aides-pretended-to-be-stupid-to-get-on-bushs-good-side/comment-page-2#comment-65574</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 11:43:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.newmajority.com/?p=12650#comment-65574</guid>
		<description>Agentprovocateur asks:

&quot;So, when do we invade Saudi Arabia, Burma, and Sudan, among many other countries?&quot;

I&#039;m not saying I have the answer, but isn&#039;t it a question at least worth discussing?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Agentprovocateur asks:</p>
<p>&#8220;So, when do we invade Saudi Arabia, Burma, and Sudan, among many other countries?&#8221;</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not saying I have the answer, but isn&#8217;t it a question at least worth discussing?</p>
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		<title>By: Jim</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/latimer-aides-pretended-to-be-stupid-to-get-on-bushs-good-side/comment-page-2#comment-65573</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 11:39:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.newmajority.com/?p=12650#comment-65573</guid>
		<description>Spartacus:

Fine, but I think you should probably change your screen name to Jane Austen.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Spartacus:</p>
<p>Fine, but I think you should probably change your screen name to Jane Austen.</p>
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		<title>By: mlindroo</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/latimer-aides-pretended-to-be-stupid-to-get-on-bushs-good-side/comment-page-2#comment-65569</link>
		<dc:creator>mlindroo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 10:17:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.newmajority.com/?p=12650#comment-65569</guid>
		<description>&gt; The big difference is of course Bush was not a minor league player when elected Pres. Obama’s rise is
&gt; astonding only in the fact he is completely unqualified. Minor league state rep, 2 year Senator with no
&gt; distinction and now Pres. 


This is highly debatable. I will agree that Obama does not have tons of experience, but he did prepare himself for the job well while with the U.S. senate by getting himself a place on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee. He lacks practical experience, true, but I think he did an impressive job during the 2008 campaign when he usually held his own in the debates against far more experienced candidates.
---
I would argue that Bush&#039;s six years as Texas Governor aren&#039;t much of a merit considering the limited powers of the office. But biographies such as Latimer&#039;s clearly suggest lack of experience was not his major shortcoming as president: I think his personality(lack of curiosity, &quot;faith based&quot; decision making etc.) and choice of advisers had more to do with it.

&gt; In only 8 months his fall from both lefty grace and national grace beats  even Carter.

Well, I read the mainstream liberal blogs and I sense no major disappointment! &quot;Politics is the art of the possible&quot; and right now the blogosphere left  seems quite confident that the Democrats will manage to pass some sort of health care reform by the end of the year, although it will not have all the features they would like.
---
Any presidency is like a long distance running contest. Even Reagan was  unpopular while the economy was not in great shape, and this remains the main reason why Obama is &quot;only&quot; doing .500 right now. My guess is the 2010 midterms will resemble 1982, i.e. the party in power will be wildly unpopular because of the recession but the opposition will only make comparatively minor gains since they have no solution to the problem either. But we will see.


MARCU$</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt; The big difference is of course Bush was not a minor league player when elected Pres. Obama’s rise is<br />
&gt; astonding only in the fact he is completely unqualified. Minor league state rep, 2 year Senator with no<br />
&gt; distinction and now Pres. </p>
<p>This is highly debatable. I will agree that Obama does not have tons of experience, but he did prepare himself for the job well while with the U.S. senate by getting himself a place on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee. He lacks practical experience, true, but I think he did an impressive job during the 2008 campaign when he usually held his own in the debates against far more experienced candidates.<br />
&#8212;<br />
I would argue that Bush&#8217;s six years as Texas Governor aren&#8217;t much of a merit considering the limited powers of the office. But biographies such as Latimer&#8217;s clearly suggest lack of experience was not his major shortcoming as president: I think his personality(lack of curiosity, &#8220;faith based&#8221; decision making etc.) and choice of advisers had more to do with it.</p>
<p>&gt; In only 8 months his fall from both lefty grace and national grace beats  even Carter.</p>
<p>Well, I read the mainstream liberal blogs and I sense no major disappointment! &#8220;Politics is the art of the possible&#8221; and right now the blogosphere left  seems quite confident that the Democrats will manage to pass some sort of health care reform by the end of the year, although it will not have all the features they would like.<br />
&#8212;<br />
Any presidency is like a long distance running contest. Even Reagan was  unpopular while the economy was not in great shape, and this remains the main reason why Obama is &#8220;only&#8221; doing .500 right now. My guess is the 2010 midterms will resemble 1982, i.e. the party in power will be wildly unpopular because of the recession but the opposition will only make comparatively minor gains since they have no solution to the problem either. But we will see.</p>
<p>MARCU$</p>
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		<title>By: SpartacusIsNotDead</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/latimer-aides-pretended-to-be-stupid-to-get-on-bushs-good-side/comment-page-2#comment-65562</link>
		<dc:creator>SpartacusIsNotDead</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 05:36:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.newmajority.com/?p=12650#comment-65562</guid>
		<description>Sdspringy thinks that a google search that cites articles that discuss whether Obama&#039;s critics are racist substantiates his initial claim that liberals will call anyone who criticizes Obama a racist.

You really should try to think this through on your own, but I&#039;ll help you out anyway.

You said liberals will call anyone who criticizes Obama a racist.  I provided many examples of people who have criticized Obama and have not been called racist.  You then respond by referring to Google search results, none of which provide any evidence that any of the critics I listed have been called racist.

Seriously, this is not that difficult and you should be able to figure out that the things you&#039;ve said - twice now - make absolutely no since whatsoever.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sdspringy thinks that a google search that cites articles that discuss whether Obama&#8217;s critics are racist substantiates his initial claim that liberals will call anyone who criticizes Obama a racist.</p>
<p>You really should try to think this through on your own, but I&#8217;ll help you out anyway.</p>
<p>You said liberals will call anyone who criticizes Obama a racist.  I provided many examples of people who have criticized Obama and have not been called racist.  You then respond by referring to Google search results, none of which provide any evidence that any of the critics I listed have been called racist.</p>
<p>Seriously, this is not that difficult and you should be able to figure out that the things you&#8217;ve said &#8211; twice now &#8211; make absolutely no since whatsoever.</p>
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		<title>By: SpartacusIsNotDead</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/latimer-aides-pretended-to-be-stupid-to-get-on-bushs-good-side/comment-page-2#comment-65561</link>
		<dc:creator>SpartacusIsNotDead</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 05:21:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.newmajority.com/?p=12650#comment-65561</guid>
		<description>Jim asked:  &quot;Do you think that oppression is wrong and should be fought? Or is “wait[ing] for the weapons inspectors to finish their job and tell him there are no WMD in Iraq” more important than freeing the people Saddam was terrorizing…..&quot;

Well, I think oppression is morally wrong, but Idon&#039;t think all instances of oppression are worth the price America has had to predicatably pay to remove Saddam.  And, policy makers of both Democratic and Republican administrations have consistently agreed with me.  We did not go to war in Iraq to stop oppression and neither Bush nor any of his Democratic or Republican predecessors eever argued we should go to war there to stop Saddam&#039;s long-running oppression.

If oppression is your prerequisite for sending American troops to war in a foreign land, then you are neither conservative nor wise.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jim asked:  &#8220;Do you think that oppression is wrong and should be fought? Or is “wait[ing] for the weapons inspectors to finish their job and tell him there are no WMD in Iraq” more important than freeing the people Saddam was terrorizing…..&#8221;</p>
<p>Well, I think oppression is morally wrong, but Idon&#8217;t think all instances of oppression are worth the price America has had to predicatably pay to remove Saddam.  And, policy makers of both Democratic and Republican administrations have consistently agreed with me.  We did not go to war in Iraq to stop oppression and neither Bush nor any of his Democratic or Republican predecessors eever argued we should go to war there to stop Saddam&#8217;s long-running oppression.</p>
<p>If oppression is your prerequisite for sending American troops to war in a foreign land, then you are neither conservative nor wise.</p>
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		<title>By: SpartacusIsNotDead</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/latimer-aides-pretended-to-be-stupid-to-get-on-bushs-good-side/comment-page-2#comment-65560</link>
		<dc:creator>SpartacusIsNotDead</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 05:14:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.newmajority.com/?p=12650#comment-65560</guid>
		<description>I meant to say we know Bush fired Shinseki .  .  .</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I meant to say we know Bush fired Shinseki .  .  .</p>
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		<title>By: SpartacusIsNotDead</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/latimer-aides-pretended-to-be-stupid-to-get-on-bushs-good-side/comment-page-2#comment-65558</link>
		<dc:creator>SpartacusIsNotDead</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 05:13:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.newmajority.com/?p=12650#comment-65558</guid>
		<description>Sinz @ #29,

The assertion that Rumsfield decided not to approve more troops does not relieve Bush of culpability for his decision not to ensure that the Afghan was adequately resourced and prepared to take advantage of an opportunity to capture OBL.  I don&#039;t know if Bush was advised to put more troops in Afghanistan or not, but if he wasn&#039;t he should have fired his advisors for not giving him the right advice.  However, we know for a fact that Bush  Gen. Shinseki right after foolishly rejecting his advice to put 300,000-500,000 troops in Iraq.

With respect to Iraq, your reference to the recommendations of Cheney, Rumsfield and Wolfowitz to go to war in Iraq only proves my point.  Bush, who was the ultimate decider, did not listen to those who advised to at least wait until after the inspectors had completed their jobs.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sinz @ #29,</p>
<p>The assertion that Rumsfield decided not to approve more troops does not relieve Bush of culpability for his decision not to ensure that the Afghan was adequately resourced and prepared to take advantage of an opportunity to capture OBL.  I don&#8217;t know if Bush was advised to put more troops in Afghanistan or not, but if he wasn&#8217;t he should have fired his advisors for not giving him the right advice.  However, we know for a fact that Bush  Gen. Shinseki right after foolishly rejecting his advice to put 300,000-500,000 troops in Iraq.</p>
<p>With respect to Iraq, your reference to the recommendations of Cheney, Rumsfield and Wolfowitz to go to war in Iraq only proves my point.  Bush, who was the ultimate decider, did not listen to those who advised to at least wait until after the inspectors had completed their jobs.</p>
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		<title>By: sdspringy</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/latimer-aides-pretended-to-be-stupid-to-get-on-bushs-good-side/comment-page-2#comment-65550</link>
		<dc:creator>sdspringy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 02:57:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.newmajority.com/?p=12650#comment-65550</guid>
		<description>Try as you might Bacon to deflect, Obama is turning out to be exactly as the Right imagined and a huge dissappointment for the Left.   When the Left starts to criticize Obama will the term racist be used to describe them?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Try as you might Bacon to deflect, Obama is turning out to be exactly as the Right imagined and a huge dissappointment for the Left.   When the Left starts to criticize Obama will the term racist be used to describe them?</p>
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		<title>By: agentprovocateur</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/latimer-aides-pretended-to-be-stupid-to-get-on-bushs-good-side/comment-page-2#comment-65549</link>
		<dc:creator>agentprovocateur</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 02:50:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.newmajority.com/?p=12650#comment-65549</guid>
		<description>&lt;b&gt;What will count in the end is the one undeniable fact, that Bush held two terms while Obama one.&lt;/b&gt;

So you have psychic powers?  Do tell us all which stocks we should buy next week.

&lt;b&gt;As far as Cheney, I think he and the dreaded neo-cons will be vindicated 10 or 20 years from now when the Middle East is no longer the fertile ground for extremism and instead is on a path of self-government.&lt;/b&gt;

You really believe that the invasion of Iraq will lead to that?  I guess that magic ponies were found rather than WMD.

&lt;b&gt;Do you think that oppression is wrong and should be fought?&lt;/b&gt;

So, when do we invade Saudi Arabia, Burma,  and Sudan, among many other countries?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What will count in the end is the one undeniable fact, that Bush held two terms while Obama one.</p>
<p>So you have psychic powers?  Do tell us all which stocks we should buy next week.</p>
<p>As far as Cheney, I think he and the dreaded neo-cons will be vindicated 10 or 20 years from now when the Middle East is no longer the fertile ground for extremism and instead is on a path of self-government.</p>
<p>You really believe that the invasion of Iraq will lead to that?  I guess that magic ponies were found rather than WMD.</p>
<p>Do you think that oppression is wrong and should be fought?</p>
<p>So, when do we invade Saudi Arabia, Burma,  and Sudan, among many other countries?</p>
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		<title>By: balconesfault</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/latimer-aides-pretended-to-be-stupid-to-get-on-bushs-good-side/comment-page-2#comment-65546</link>
		<dc:creator>balconesfault</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 02:30:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.newmajority.com/?p=12650#comment-65546</guid>
		<description>&lt;b&gt;and not come away with thousands of examples of people being referred to as racist for criticizing the Messiah.&lt;/b&gt;

You realize that the &quot;Messiah&quot; thing is pretty much a declaration that you don&#039;t take Christianity seriously.

Meanwhile, there are lots of examples of people making patently racist attacks on Obama.  Not a surprise that they get cited a lot.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>and not come away with thousands of examples of people being referred to as racist for criticizing the Messiah.</p>
<p>You realize that the &#8220;Messiah&#8221; thing is pretty much a declaration that you don&#8217;t take Christianity seriously.</p>
<p>Meanwhile, there are lots of examples of people making patently racist attacks on Obama.  Not a surprise that they get cited a lot.</p>
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