Comments on: Inner City Schools: They’re Your Cause Too http://www.frumforum.com/inner-city-schools-theyre-your-cause-too Building a conservatism that can win again Sat, 11 Feb 2012 17:50:44 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: midcon http://www.frumforum.com/inner-city-schools-theyre-your-cause-too/comment-page-1#comment-55278 midcon Tue, 10 Mar 2009 19:07:07 +0000 #comment-55278 The President of the University of DC (UDC) has been soundly chatized by the students, faculty, and others for having the gall to want to upgrade the university by raising standards, creating a 2 yr community college, and improving the infrastructure, etc. What he wants to change is the laughable 16% graduation rate. Apparently is a voice in the wilderness because the rest don't seem to care. I believe Washington DC almost tops the list in spending per student ($16K +). Their graduation rate from high schools is a depressing 59%. Do you think more money is the answer? If the teachers care, and the students care, and the parents care, you can learn in almost any environment. More money for schools is a recipe for more depressing statistics. While such data for voucher students is not available, at least I know that the parents of the voucher student care about their child's education. It's not Republicans you have to inspire it's the people! The President of the University of DC (UDC) has been soundly chatized by the students, faculty, and others for having the gall to want to upgrade the university by raising standards, creating a 2 yr community college, and improving the infrastructure, etc. What he wants to change is the laughable 16% graduation rate. Apparently is a voice in the wilderness because the rest don’t seem to care. I believe Washington DC almost tops the list in spending per student ($16K +). Their graduation rate from high schools is a depressing 59%. Do you think more money is the answer? If the teachers care, and the students care, and the parents care, you can learn in almost any environment. More money for schools is a recipe for more depressing statistics. While such data for voucher students is not available, at least I know that the parents of the voucher student care about their child’s education. It’s not Republicans you have to inspire it’s the people!

]]> By: mriebling http://www.frumforum.com/inner-city-schools-theyre-your-cause-too/comment-page-1#comment-42825 mriebling Tue, 10 Mar 2009 14:16:38 +0000 #comment-42825 Gibbon is right. A major investment in teachers and money is necessary to counteract the troubling circumstances of inner-city education. But how do you inspire millions of Republicans to take over a cause that they have been oblivious to for generations? Are we to believe that Republicans are so desperate for a new agenda, a new movement, dare I say, a new majority that they are going to take ownership of this issue because it can help them win future elections? Not likely. In a party that doesn't believe in government solving problems, education will always fall by the wayside because it requires a community effort. Gibbon is right. A major investment in teachers and money is necessary to counteract the troubling circumstances of inner-city education. But how do you inspire millions of Republicans to take over a cause that they have been oblivious to for generations? Are we to believe that Republicans are so desperate for a new agenda, a new movement, dare I say, a new majority that they are going to take ownership of this issue because it can help them win future elections? Not likely.

In a party that doesn’t believe in government solving problems, education will always fall by the wayside because it requires a community effort.

]]> By: Cforchange http://www.frumforum.com/inner-city-schools-theyre-your-cause-too/comment-page-1#comment-50608 Cforchange Tue, 10 Mar 2009 12:46:13 +0000 #comment-50608 Sinz - no matter where the problem started, we just sat through a decade of Republican leadership and I watched this problem implode before my very eyes. Few in the party reconized nor acted. Drug business and addiction is a huge huge problem - why has this not been a Rush endorsed topic? In general the Republican's mostly moved to the xburbs, where dreams of prospering danced through their heads. At the same time, many contributed to the drug problem by venturing into the city to purchase their piece of the action -usually sending the local contractor for them who proudly displays his address on the truck! Ha, I've seen it all - Viagra and $10 tricks, really paternity testing is in order. But back to the child, children convicted of a felony can no longer receive help from the state so they are forced right there into a life of crime. I know a woman who has dedicated her life to informing of this problem - she gets little traction. For these children maybe working at 12 was a necessity because their household was lead by a parent who was mostly out on their 2+ week crack binge. There are no schools left in the neighborhood and certainly there aren't any businesses to employ anyone legally. CamdenNJ style communities are taking hold everywhere. Back to the child one more time: for the sake of keeping a "family" together we are devastating the child. The mantra of no child left behind totally overlooked this segment and their plight is just heartbreaking that is until they start shooting back. Also ownership of this phrase but lacking action for the unwanted or poorly parented and exploited child has not been beneficial for our cause. Sinz – no matter where the problem started, we just sat through a decade of Republican leadership and I watched this problem implode before my very eyes. Few in the party reconized nor acted. Drug business and addiction is a huge huge problem – why has this not been a Rush endorsed topic? In general the Republican’s mostly moved to the xburbs, where dreams of prospering danced through their heads. At the same time, many contributed to the drug problem by venturing into the city to purchase their piece of the action -usually sending the local contractor for them who proudly displays his address on the truck! Ha, I’ve seen it all – Viagra and $10 tricks, really paternity testing is in order. But back to the child, children convicted of a felony can no longer receive help from the state so they are forced right there into a life of crime. I know a woman who has dedicated her life to informing of this problem – she gets little traction. For these children maybe working at 12 was a necessity because their household was lead by a parent who was mostly out on their 2+ week crack binge. There are no schools left in the neighborhood and certainly there aren’t any businesses to employ anyone legally. CamdenNJ style communities are taking hold everywhere. Back to the child one more time: for the sake of keeping a “family” together we are devastating the child. The mantra of no child left behind totally overlooked this segment and their plight is just heartbreaking that is until they start shooting back. Also ownership of this phrase but lacking action for the unwanted or poorly parented and exploited child has not been beneficial for our cause.

]]> By: sinz54 http://www.frumforum.com/inner-city-schools-theyre-your-cause-too/comment-page-1#comment-51252 sinz54 Tue, 10 Mar 2009 11:27:01 +0000 #comment-51252 Cforchange: The urban narcotics problem was exacerbated by Clinton's "three strikes and you're out" law, and all the politicians of BOTH parties who pander to fear by raising penalties for drug use and drug dealing. "Three strikes and you're out" has turned into a conveyor belt to transport young black men to 10 years in prison, from where they emerge as hardened convicts. What happens is that the first time a guy is caught in the drug trade, a public defender gets him a plea-bargained suspended sentence, and of course the guy takes it--and he's immediately back out on the streets without counseling or help. This happens a second time. The third time, the guy is out, up the river for years. Over a million young black men have done hard time in this way. Their lives have been, for the most part, ruined. Cforchange: The urban narcotics problem was exacerbated by Clinton’s “three strikes and you’re out” law, and all the politicians of BOTH parties who pander to fear by raising penalties for drug use and drug dealing. “Three strikes and you’re out” has turned into a conveyor belt to transport young black men to 10 years in prison, from where they emerge as hardened convicts. What happens is that the first time a guy is caught in the drug trade, a public defender gets him a plea-bargained suspended sentence, and of course the guy takes it–and he’s immediately back out on the streets without counseling or help. This happens a second time. The third time, the guy is out, up the river for years. Over a million young black men have done hard time in this way. Their lives have been, for the most part, ruined.

]]> By: Cforchange http://www.frumforum.com/inner-city-schools-theyre-your-cause-too/comment-page-1#comment-47288 Cforchange Tue, 10 Mar 2009 11:12:43 +0000 #comment-47288 Well now you are on to the big frontier! While I do not reside in the city I am very inolved in my urban neighborhood. I am the only Republican at the table, we all volunteer and those in it for the long haul revitilization prospect are far from self serving. School choice is one level of the problem - it's more complex than that. There are so many children that are living in plainly unsuitable circumstances that they are in absolutely no shape to be educated period. Some of these children are working the streets to feed many younger siblings even though a "parent" is compensated to care for them. We have left hundreds of children behind because this problem has not been addressed. Further complicating the situation we have excused hundreds of adults from mental institutions so not only are these children neglected in their own homes, the streets are just crawling with opportunistic crazies. If you work the circuit of community organizing(another insulting pi$$off from the last election) you will find that most of the grief eminates from the drug trade - abuse of seniors, animals, women and children overwhelmingly (over 90%) have crack and heroin behind the scenes. I blame Republicans for being too heartless and geographically remote from the problems that hurt everyone. Either too naive to understand why a community needs reorganized(and that doesn't mean labor) or too cowardly to confront personal flaws that connect them as a contributor to the problem. I would aleast have some respect for Rushbo if he could show up at the urban narcotics buffet available in any city close by and learn why this is the problem that is bringing us to our knees. Well now you are on to the big frontier! While I do not reside in the city I am very inolved in my urban neighborhood. I am the only Republican at the table, we all volunteer and those in it for the long haul revitilization prospect are far from self serving. School choice is one level of the problem – it’s more complex than that. There are so many children that are living in plainly unsuitable circumstances that they are in absolutely no shape to be educated period. Some of these children are working the streets to feed many younger siblings even though a “parent” is compensated to care for them. We have left hundreds of children behind because this problem has not been addressed. Further complicating the situation we have excused hundreds of adults from mental institutions so not only are these children neglected in their own homes, the streets are just crawling with opportunistic crazies. If you work the circuit of community organizing(another insulting pi$$off from the last election) you will find that most of the grief eminates from the drug trade – abuse of seniors, animals, women and children overwhelmingly (over 90%) have crack and heroin behind the scenes. I blame Republicans for being too heartless and geographically remote from the problems that hurt everyone. Either too naive to understand why a community needs reorganized(and that doesn’t mean labor) or too cowardly to confront personal flaws that connect them as a contributor to the problem. I would aleast have some respect for Rushbo if he could show up at the urban narcotics buffet available in any city close by and learn why this is the problem that is bringing us to our knees.

]]> By: Dan Crank http://www.frumforum.com/inner-city-schools-theyre-your-cause-too/comment-page-1#comment-50529 Dan Crank Tue, 10 Mar 2009 10:56:19 +0000 #comment-50529 The truth with these intercity schools is probably a little more than you all can handle. The truth is that regardless of the best intentions of gifted dedicated teachers they can only reach few individuals and as a whole the schools themselves will never get better. The reason is the parents. Good teaching can not over ride bad parenting across the board, only in single instances. Not all but most of these parents just do not care and there is nothing that can be done for that. Talk to a police officer that makes domestic calls in these neighborhoods and sees what happens in the homes of some of these people. I think you would be shocked. I find it amazing that on a daily basis so many students in inner cities wake up and go to these crappy and undervalued and under resourced schools this is all over the country too. If the people in these communities really cared as a whole then these schools would not be in the shape they are in. If you took these kids and switched them as a unit to a new brand new school how long until it will be run down? Some times reality is a hard pill to swallow, not unlike this administration. The truth with these intercity schools is probably a little more than you all can handle. The truth is that regardless of the best intentions of gifted dedicated teachers they can only reach few individuals and as a whole the schools themselves will never get better. The reason is the parents. Good teaching can not over ride bad parenting across the board, only in single instances. Not all but most of these parents just do not care and there is nothing that can be done for that. Talk to a police officer that makes domestic calls in these neighborhoods and sees what happens in the homes of some of these people. I think you would be shocked. I find it amazing that on a daily basis so many students in inner cities wake up and go to these crappy and undervalued and under resourced schools this is all over the country too. If the people in these communities really cared as a whole then these schools would not be in the shape they are in. If you took these kids and switched them as a unit to a new brand new school how long until it will be run down? Some times reality is a hard pill to swallow, not unlike this administration.

]]> By: danbmil99 http://www.frumforum.com/inner-city-schools-theyre-your-cause-too/comment-page-1#comment-41127 danbmil99 Tue, 10 Mar 2009 04:06:14 +0000 #comment-41127 Mr Joe: competition is a part of the problem, but hardly the whole picture. Even with vouchers, the schools that service poor people will continue to be under-resourced. I am a free-market, libertarian-leaning fiscal conservative. However, I have slowly come to the realization that absolutist ideology is usually wrong. The government does exist for a reason, and providing education to poor people is one area where I have come to agree with liberals. The problem is that the next generation did not choose their parents, their neighborhood, or their social and economic standing. They need to be shown that individualism and economic empowerment equal opportunity, not government hand-outs. They certainly aren't learning that from their schools; the closest they get to an education in capitalism is by watching the local drug dealer get rich supplying a product in high demand. Mr Joe: competition is a part of the problem, but hardly the whole picture. Even with vouchers, the schools that service poor people will continue to be under-resourced. I am a free-market, libertarian-leaning fiscal conservative. However, I have slowly come to the realization that absolutist ideology is usually wrong. The government does exist for a reason, and providing education to poor people is one area where I have come to agree with liberals. The problem is that the next generation did not choose their parents, their neighborhood, or their social and economic standing. They need to be shown that individualism and economic empowerment equal opportunity, not government hand-outs. They certainly aren’t learning that from their schools; the closest they get to an education in capitalism is by watching the local drug dealer get rich supplying a product in high demand.

]]> By: Mr.Joe http://www.frumforum.com/inner-city-schools-theyre-your-cause-too/comment-page-1#comment-52558 Mr.Joe Tue, 10 Mar 2009 01:55:14 +0000 #comment-52558 The answer to better public schools is competition and choice. Charter schools, vouchers, and other options will force public schools to be competative. We don't do it because teachers unions oppose it. They know it would result in the dead wood being let go. Better the kids suffer instead. The answer to better public schools is competition and choice. Charter schools, vouchers, and other options will force public schools to be competative. We don’t do it because teachers unions oppose it. They know it would result in the dead wood being let go. Better the kids suffer instead.

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