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	<title>Comments on: Holder Will Be Held Accountable</title>
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	<description>Building a conservatism that can win again</description>
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		<title>By: balconesfault</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/holder-will-be-held-accountable/comment-page-5#comment-73675</link>
		<dc:creator>balconesfault</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 17:17:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=16329#comment-73675</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t see any reason why the presiding judge would allow testimony as to &quot;why they did it&quot;.   Unless &quot;why they did it&quot; could be related to a claim of self-defense, it has no place in the determination of guilt or innocence for the plaintiffs.

If the claim is that they need to make their pitch prior to sentencing, in order to claim mitigating circumstances, the court can easily have a closed sentencing hearing following the conviction.

Anyway ... none of us are going to be &quot;hearing&quot; any of the testimony, unless we can somehow attend in person.  There won&#039;t be any TV or radio feed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t see any reason why the presiding judge would allow testimony as to &#8220;why they did it&#8221;.   Unless &#8220;why they did it&#8221; could be related to a claim of self-defense, it has no place in the determination of guilt or innocence for the plaintiffs.</p>
<p>If the claim is that they need to make their pitch prior to sentencing, in order to claim mitigating circumstances, the court can easily have a closed sentencing hearing following the conviction.</p>
<p>Anyway &#8230; none of us are going to be &#8220;hearing&#8221; any of the testimony, unless we can somehow attend in person.  There won&#8217;t be any TV or radio feed.</p>
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		<title>By: sinz54</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/holder-will-be-held-accountable/comment-page-4#comment-73637</link>
		<dc:creator>sinz54</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 15:51:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=16329#comment-73637</guid>
		<description>From today&#039;s Washington Post:

&lt;blockquote&gt;Nation Digest
Monday, November 23, 2009
NEW YORK

&lt;b&gt;Sept. 11 defendants to plead not guilty&lt;/b&gt;

The five men facing trial in the Sept. 11 attacks will plead not guilty so that they can air their criticisms of U.S. foreign policy, an attorney for one of the defendants said Sunday.

Scott Fenstermaker, who is representing Ali Abd al-Aziz Ali, said the men would not deny their role in the 2001 attacks but &quot;would explain what happened and why they did it.&quot; The Justice Department announced earlier this month that Ali and four other men will face a civilian federal trial just blocks from the site of the destroyed World Trade Center in New York.

Ali, also known as Ammar al-Baluchi, is a nephew of professed 9/11 mastermind Khalid Sheik Mohammed.

Mohammed, Ali and the others will explain &quot;their assessment of American foreign policy,&quot; Fenstermaker said. &quot;Their assessment is negative,&quot; he said. &lt;/blockquote&gt;
I hope all of America&#039;s left-wingers enjoy hearing their own &quot;negative assessment of American foreign policy&quot; being echoed by a bunch of Islamist terrorists.  Let&#039;s hear Khalid Sheikh Mohammed attack U.S. support for Israel, globalization, and hey, maybe he&#039;ll even mention Vietnam.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From today&#8217;s Washington Post:</p>
<blockquote><p>Nation Digest<br />
Monday, November 23, 2009<br />
NEW YORK</p>
<p><b>Sept. 11 defendants to plead not guilty</b></p>
<p>The five men facing trial in the Sept. 11 attacks will plead not guilty so that they can air their criticisms of U.S. foreign policy, an attorney for one of the defendants said Sunday.</p>
<p>Scott Fenstermaker, who is representing Ali Abd al-Aziz Ali, said the men would not deny their role in the 2001 attacks but &#8220;would explain what happened and why they did it.&#8221; The Justice Department announced earlier this month that Ali and four other men will face a civilian federal trial just blocks from the site of the destroyed World Trade Center in New York.</p>
<p>Ali, also known as Ammar al-Baluchi, is a nephew of professed 9/11 mastermind Khalid Sheik Mohammed.</p>
<p>Mohammed, Ali and the others will explain &#8220;their assessment of American foreign policy,&#8221; Fenstermaker said. &#8220;Their assessment is negative,&#8221; he said. </p></blockquote>
<p>I hope all of America&#8217;s left-wingers enjoy hearing their own &#8220;negative assessment of American foreign policy&#8221; being echoed by a bunch of Islamist terrorists.  Let&#8217;s hear Khalid Sheikh Mohammed attack U.S. support for Israel, globalization, and hey, maybe he&#8217;ll even mention Vietnam.</p>
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		<title>By: ottovbvs</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/holder-will-be-held-accountable/comment-page-4#comment-73629</link>
		<dc:creator>ottovbvs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 15:34:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=16329#comment-73629</guid>
		<description>balconesfault // Nov 22, 2009 at 8:35 pm

&quot; Not really. You don’t have to go there.&quot;

.....I&#039;m afraid I don&#039;t agree.....most of them equate morality with christianity, it&#039;s inconceivable to them that aspects of the muslim religion are highly moral.....or that that atheistic humanism can be highly moral</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>balconesfault // Nov 22, 2009 at 8:35 pm</p>
<p>&#8221; Not really. You don’t have to go there.&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8230;..I&#8217;m afraid I don&#8217;t agree&#8230;..most of them equate morality with christianity, it&#8217;s inconceivable to them that aspects of the muslim religion are highly moral&#8230;..or that that atheistic humanism can be highly moral</p>
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		<title>By: balconesfault</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/holder-will-be-held-accountable/comment-page-4#comment-73511</link>
		<dc:creator>balconesfault</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 01:35:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=16329#comment-73511</guid>
		<description>&lt;b&gt;so that endows it with a special christian character&lt;/b&gt;

Not really.  You don&#039;t have to go there.

The idea becomes that since the US is the most moral nation on the earth, it is necessary to preserve the US in order to preserve morality on the earth.

However, our enemies use immoral tactics - and if we do not reduce our standards of morality while fighting our enemies, we will lose (we&#039;ll set aside right now what &quot;losing&quot; means when we&#039;re spending a trillion a year on national defense).

Thus, any immoral act is inherently moral.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><b>so that endows it with a special christian character</b></p>
<p>Not really.  You don&#8217;t have to go there.</p>
<p>The idea becomes that since the US is the most moral nation on the earth, it is necessary to preserve the US in order to preserve morality on the earth.</p>
<p>However, our enemies use immoral tactics &#8211; and if we do not reduce our standards of morality while fighting our enemies, we will lose (we&#8217;ll set aside right now what &#8220;losing&#8221; means when we&#8217;re spending a trillion a year on national defense).</p>
<p>Thus, any immoral act is inherently moral.</p>
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		<title>By: ottovbvs</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/holder-will-be-held-accountable/comment-page-4#comment-73504</link>
		<dc:creator>ottovbvs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 01:02:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=16329#comment-73504</guid>
		<description>balconesfault // Nov 22, 2009 at 7:30 pm 

&quot;And they believe that no matter what America does.&quot;

.........they believe that torture, secret prisons, illegal kidnaps, are morally right because were doing it so that endows it with a special christian character</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>balconesfault // Nov 22, 2009 at 7:30 pm </p>
<p>&#8220;And they believe that no matter what America does.&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;they believe that torture, secret prisons, illegal kidnaps, are morally right because were doing it so that endows it with a special christian character</p>
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		<title>By: balconesfault</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/holder-will-be-held-accountable/comment-page-4#comment-73496</link>
		<dc:creator>balconesfault</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 00:30:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=16329#comment-73496</guid>
		<description>sinz:  &lt;b&gt;Republicans have one thing going for them: They really believe America is MORALLY better than all those we’ve ever fought and are fighting today.&lt;b&gt;

And they believe that no matter what America does.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>sinz:  <b>Republicans have one thing going for them: They really believe America is MORALLY better than all those we’ve ever fought and are fighting today.</b><b></p>
<p>And they believe that no matter what America does.</b></p>
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		<title>By: ottovbvs</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/holder-will-be-held-accountable/comment-page-4#comment-73420</link>
		<dc:creator>ottovbvs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Nov 2009 15:37:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=16329#comment-73420</guid>
		<description>sinz54 // Nov 22, 2009 at 9:58 am 

&quot;And we will.
We’ll hang that fiasco around Obama’s neck.&quot;

.......As I said licking his lips in the hope of an &quot;incident&quot;.....the more fatalities the better......deplorable

&quot;Republicans have one thing going for them: They really believe America is MORALLY better than all those we’ve ever fought and are fighting today. It’s real hard to fight an implacable ruthless enemy when you’re paralyzed by neurotic guilt about your own country, as too many of your fellow liberals are.

If the trial of KSM turns into a fiasco, the United States will suffer tremendously. Can we all agree on that? You too, ottovbs? It’s not going to be a good thing for this country if that trial flops.&quot;

......You&#039;ve got the paranoia bad buddy.........Eric Holder is paralyzed by neurotic guilt (not a lawyer with total integrity and respect for the law).......the trial is going to be a fiasco (after all those military commissions turned into such a huge success)

......Unfortunatly Sinz although on the surface you are bit more restrained than total fruitcakes like mi-goper you&#039;re just as consumed with hate and anger.....it&#039;s a sad commentary on the state of today&#039;s GOP and a clear demonstration of  why I and so many others have jumped ship.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>sinz54 // Nov 22, 2009 at 9:58 am </p>
<p>&#8220;And we will.<br />
We’ll hang that fiasco around Obama’s neck.&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8230;&#8230;.As I said licking his lips in the hope of an &#8220;incident&#8221;&#8230;..the more fatalities the better&#8230;&#8230;deplorable</p>
<p>&#8220;Republicans have one thing going for them: They really believe America is MORALLY better than all those we’ve ever fought and are fighting today. It’s real hard to fight an implacable ruthless enemy when you’re paralyzed by neurotic guilt about your own country, as too many of your fellow liberals are.</p>
<p>If the trial of KSM turns into a fiasco, the United States will suffer tremendously. Can we all agree on that? You too, ottovbs? It’s not going to be a good thing for this country if that trial flops.&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8230;&#8230;You&#8217;ve got the paranoia bad buddy&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;Eric Holder is paralyzed by neurotic guilt (not a lawyer with total integrity and respect for the law)&#8230;&#8230;.the trial is going to be a fiasco (after all those military commissions turned into such a huge success)</p>
<p>&#8230;&#8230;Unfortunatly Sinz although on the surface you are bit more restrained than total fruitcakes like mi-goper you&#8217;re just as consumed with hate and anger&#8230;..it&#8217;s a sad commentary on the state of today&#8217;s GOP and a clear demonstration of  why I and so many others have jumped ship.</p>
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		<title>By: sinz54</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/holder-will-be-held-accountable/comment-page-4#comment-73414</link>
		<dc:creator>sinz54</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Nov 2009 14:58:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=16329#comment-73414</guid>
		<description>balconesfault: &lt;blockquote&gt; Sinz is absolutely concerned about preventing attacks on America – and to the extent he favors Republicans, it is because he holds the (imo false) opinion that Republicans do a much better job of this. &lt;/blockquote&gt;
That is exactly correct.

Republicans have one thing going for them:  They really believe America is MORALLY better than all those we&#039;ve ever fought and are fighting today.  It&#039;s real hard to fight an implacable ruthless enemy when you&#039;re paralyzed by neurotic guilt about your own country, as too many of your fellow liberals are.

If the trial of KSM turns into a fiasco, the United States will suffer tremendously. Can we all agree on that?  You too, ottovbs?  It&#039;s not going to be a good thing for this country if that trial flops.

BUT:  As your very own Rahm Emanuel said, &quot;Never let a crisis go to waste.&quot;
IF the KSM trial flops, there&#039;s nothing that we can do about it.  So there&#039;s no reason that we conservatives can&#039;t take advantage of it.

And we will.
We&#039;ll hang that fiasco around Obama&#039;s neck.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>balconesfault:<br />
<blockquote> Sinz is absolutely concerned about preventing attacks on America – and to the extent he favors Republicans, it is because he holds the (imo false) opinion that Republicans do a much better job of this. </p></blockquote>
<p>That is exactly correct.</p>
<p>Republicans have one thing going for them:  They really believe America is MORALLY better than all those we&#8217;ve ever fought and are fighting today.  It&#8217;s real hard to fight an implacable ruthless enemy when you&#8217;re paralyzed by neurotic guilt about your own country, as too many of your fellow liberals are.</p>
<p>If the trial of KSM turns into a fiasco, the United States will suffer tremendously. Can we all agree on that?  You too, ottovbs?  It&#8217;s not going to be a good thing for this country if that trial flops.</p>
<p>BUT:  As your very own Rahm Emanuel said, &#8220;Never let a crisis go to waste.&#8221;<br />
IF the KSM trial flops, there&#8217;s nothing that we can do about it.  So there&#8217;s no reason that we conservatives can&#8217;t take advantage of it.</p>
<p>And we will.<br />
We&#8217;ll hang that fiasco around Obama&#8217;s neck.</p>
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		<title>By: MI-GOPer</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/holder-will-be-held-accountable/comment-page-4#comment-73376</link>
		<dc:creator>MI-GOPer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Nov 2009 04:01:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=16329#comment-73376</guid>
		<description>AutomaticBSer writes: &quot;You’re (BlankHead) being more charitable than me…..I suggest you read his (sinz54)  posts on this topic a little more closely…..you can almost hear him licking his lips in anticipation……it’s totally deplorable&quot;

I don&#039;t there&#039;s anyone on this site, familiar with sinz54&#039;s commentary, that would agree with your harshly partisan, suspect and incredible assessment of sinz54.

But then, automaticBSer, we&#039;ve come to expect stupid things from you... you are, afterall, still the Village Idiot on this site.  Someone toss the troll a ferret, will you?  He&#039;s needy for attention --any attention is sufficient.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>AutomaticBSer writes: &#8220;You’re (BlankHead) being more charitable than me…..I suggest you read his (sinz54)  posts on this topic a little more closely…..you can almost hear him licking his lips in anticipation……it’s totally deplorable&#8221;</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t there&#8217;s anyone on this site, familiar with sinz54&#8217;s commentary, that would agree with your harshly partisan, suspect and incredible assessment of sinz54.</p>
<p>But then, automaticBSer, we&#8217;ve come to expect stupid things from you&#8230; you are, afterall, still the Village Idiot on this site.  Someone toss the troll a ferret, will you?  He&#8217;s needy for attention &#8211;any attention is sufficient.</p>
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		<title>By: ottovbvs</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/holder-will-be-held-accountable/comment-page-4#comment-73337</link>
		<dc:creator>ottovbvs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 Nov 2009 23:59:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=16329#comment-73337</guid>
		<description>MI-GOPer // Nov 21, 2009 at 4:49 pm

“FrumForum.com is a site edited by David Frum, dedicated to the modernization and renewal of the Republican party and the conservative movement.”


........Unfortunately what you don&#039;t get is that your particular brand of screwiness has no electoral appeal outside of fellow screwballs who represent maybe 25% of the electorate 

&quot;but then, I don’t get how you gain a kick from all this&quot;

........Schadenfreude......it&#039;s screwballs like you who are responsible for the predicament the GOP is in......the sooner you are banished the better</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>MI-GOPer // Nov 21, 2009 at 4:49 pm</p>
<p>“FrumForum.com is a site edited by David Frum, dedicated to the modernization and renewal of the Republican party and the conservative movement.”</p>
<p>&#8230;&#8230;..Unfortunately what you don&#8217;t get is that your particular brand of screwiness has no electoral appeal outside of fellow screwballs who represent maybe 25% of the electorate </p>
<p>&#8220;but then, I don’t get how you gain a kick from all this&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8230;&#8230;..Schadenfreude&#8230;&#8230;it&#8217;s screwballs like you who are responsible for the predicament the GOP is in&#8230;&#8230;the sooner you are banished the better</p>
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