<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Gingrich: Afghanistan &#8220;Won&#8217;t End Well&#8221;</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.frumforum.com/gingrich-afghanistan-wont-end-well/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.frumforum.com/gingrich-afghanistan-wont-end-well</link>
	<description>Building a conservatism that can win again</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 11 Feb 2012 17:50:44 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2</generator>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
		<item>
		<title>By: snxster</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/gingrich-afghanistan-wont-end-well/comment-page-1#comment-126697</link>
		<dc:creator>snxster</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jul 2010 08:41:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=37092#comment-126697</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m appalled that anyone that calls themselves conservatives can even contemplate voting for someone as morally and ethically corrupt as Newt Gingrich. This guy is a Republican in Name Only and he is in no way a Reagan Republican. Gingrich voted FOR the Department of Education, FOR NAFTA and GATT. Hell, we&#039;re in Bill Clinton&#039;s NAFTA and GATT because of all of Newt Gingrich&#039;s pushing of the bill in Congress.  Gingrich is just a pandering buffoon who will say anything to get elected.  Hell, read this article. It outlines Gingrich&#039;s bullshit policies:

http://www.unelected.org/2010/07/21/socialist-of-the-week-newt-gingrich/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m appalled that anyone that calls themselves conservatives can even contemplate voting for someone as morally and ethically corrupt as Newt Gingrich. This guy is a Republican in Name Only and he is in no way a Reagan Republican. Gingrich voted FOR the Department of Education, FOR NAFTA and GATT. Hell, we&#8217;re in Bill Clinton&#8217;s NAFTA and GATT because of all of Newt Gingrich&#8217;s pushing of the bill in Congress.  Gingrich is just a pandering buffoon who will say anything to get elected.  Hell, read this article. It outlines Gingrich&#8217;s bullshit policies:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.unelected.org/2010/07/21/socialist-of-the-week-newt-gingrich/" rel="nofollow">http://www.unelected.org/2010/07/21/socialist-of-the-week-newt-gingrich/</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: busboy33</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/gingrich-afghanistan-wont-end-well/comment-page-1#comment-123672</link>
		<dc:creator>busboy33</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jul 2010 22:24:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=37092#comment-123672</guid>
		<description>&quot;Gingrich: Afghanistan &#039;Won’t End Well&#039; &quot;

See, I was confused before.  I thought invading Afganistan, especially deciding halfway thru to also invade Iraq simultaneous, would be a glorious patriotic cakewalk.  He must have found something new and explosive out . . . because otherwise he&#039;d have been complaining about this from the get-go, right?  Since any person over the age of 10 could have guessed this answer.

How did Gingritch pry this super-classified information loose from the Obama Administration?  Good show, old bean!  What finally clued you in?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Gingrich: Afghanistan &#8216;Won’t End Well&#8217; &#8221;</p>
<p>See, I was confused before.  I thought invading Afganistan, especially deciding halfway thru to also invade Iraq simultaneous, would be a glorious patriotic cakewalk.  He must have found something new and explosive out . . . because otherwise he&#8217;d have been complaining about this from the get-go, right?  Since any person over the age of 10 could have guessed this answer.</p>
<p>How did Gingritch pry this super-classified information loose from the Obama Administration?  Good show, old bean!  What finally clued you in?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: easton</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/gingrich-afghanistan-wont-end-well/comment-page-1#comment-123473</link>
		<dc:creator>easton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jul 2010 16:38:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=37092#comment-123473</guid>
		<description>&quot;They took power because nobody else in the country really cared&quot; I don&#039;t think that is true. The Taliban are primarily Pashtun and they were funded, armed, and trained by Pakistan. They also never did subdue the entire country, with the Northern Alliance holding onto a small portion, they were also never recognized by any other country besides Pakistan. The ISI and Pakistan was intimately involved with the Taliban leadership for years (and still are). 

I think the best chance to win the war is to crush the Pashtuns dream of dominating the country politically, the best way to do this is to arm and train the other ethnic minorities. It will probably cause a civil war, but it is a civil war our preferred side can win.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;They took power because nobody else in the country really cared&#8221; I don&#8217;t think that is true. The Taliban are primarily Pashtun and they were funded, armed, and trained by Pakistan. They also never did subdue the entire country, with the Northern Alliance holding onto a small portion, they were also never recognized by any other country besides Pakistan. The ISI and Pakistan was intimately involved with the Taliban leadership for years (and still are). </p>
<p>I think the best chance to win the war is to crush the Pashtuns dream of dominating the country politically, the best way to do this is to arm and train the other ethnic minorities. It will probably cause a civil war, but it is a civil war our preferred side can win.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: DFL</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/gingrich-afghanistan-wont-end-well/comment-page-1#comment-123379</link>
		<dc:creator>DFL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jul 2010 13:36:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=37092#comment-123379</guid>
		<description>balconesfault, that was an excellent post.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>balconesfault, that was an excellent post.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: balconesfault</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/gingrich-afghanistan-wont-end-well/comment-page-1#comment-123340</link>
		<dc:creator>balconesfault</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jul 2010 08:10:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=37092#comment-123340</guid>
		<description>I unfortunately agree that Afghanistan &quot;won&#039;t end well&quot; ... but I believe it&#039;s because of overreach in our first principles.

The Taliban didn&#039;t take power in Afghanistan because they were some evil cabal intent on building a power base to export global Islamic revolution.  They took power because nobody else in the country really cared, and the system of local warlord control was so corrupt that those who did care actually welcomed some centralized legal system to protect them from the warlords.

Up until the moment Al Qaeda flew planes into US buildings, the Taliban&#039;s most prominent conflict was their civil war with the Northern Alliance, which was formed not because the local warlords were against imposition of Sharia law, but because they were opposed to any law trumping their own local power. 

For the most part, it seems that the Taliban allowed Al Qaeda to operate freely not because they shared Al Qaeda&#039;s desire to bring down America ... but because Al Qaeda served as their henchmen when they needed dirty work done against rebelling warlords, and because Bin Laden had the connections to get money flowing from the Arab world into Afghanistan, which was becoming significantly poorer after the Taliban had banned poppy production.

Crushing the Taliban, as we did in 2002, was a necessary response to the 9/11 attacks - but it has always been folly to think we could nation build our way into Afghanistan not harboring terrorists once again.  The way to keep Afghanistan from harboring terrorists was to let the Taliban know it was in their best interests to not allow terrorists to operate there anymore, a message we effectively established in a few months of our invasion.  But it was almost inevitable that if we kept pumping billions of dollars into some new government while sending in our troops to protect it, we were most likely going to cultivate a government of corruption.

I know it&#039;s nice if there are schools for women and elections and a liberal western view of pluralism.  But the Afghan people are going to have to decide that they really want that, and are willing to fight for it.  Meanwhile, imo the longer our Humvees and tanks roll up and down Afghan streets, and our helicopters and fighters and drones patrol Afghan skies, the more we feed the kind of nationalism that will have people turning to the Taliban as a primary tool for driving us out of their country.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I unfortunately agree that Afghanistan &#8220;won&#8217;t end well&#8221; &#8230; but I believe it&#8217;s because of overreach in our first principles.</p>
<p>The Taliban didn&#8217;t take power in Afghanistan because they were some evil cabal intent on building a power base to export global Islamic revolution.  They took power because nobody else in the country really cared, and the system of local warlord control was so corrupt that those who did care actually welcomed some centralized legal system to protect them from the warlords.</p>
<p>Up until the moment Al Qaeda flew planes into US buildings, the Taliban&#8217;s most prominent conflict was their civil war with the Northern Alliance, which was formed not because the local warlords were against imposition of Sharia law, but because they were opposed to any law trumping their own local power. </p>
<p>For the most part, it seems that the Taliban allowed Al Qaeda to operate freely not because they shared Al Qaeda&#8217;s desire to bring down America &#8230; but because Al Qaeda served as their henchmen when they needed dirty work done against rebelling warlords, and because Bin Laden had the connections to get money flowing from the Arab world into Afghanistan, which was becoming significantly poorer after the Taliban had banned poppy production.</p>
<p>Crushing the Taliban, as we did in 2002, was a necessary response to the 9/11 attacks &#8211; but it has always been folly to think we could nation build our way into Afghanistan not harboring terrorists once again.  The way to keep Afghanistan from harboring terrorists was to let the Taliban know it was in their best interests to not allow terrorists to operate there anymore, a message we effectively established in a few months of our invasion.  But it was almost inevitable that if we kept pumping billions of dollars into some new government while sending in our troops to protect it, we were most likely going to cultivate a government of corruption.</p>
<p>I know it&#8217;s nice if there are schools for women and elections and a liberal western view of pluralism.  But the Afghan people are going to have to decide that they really want that, and are willing to fight for it.  Meanwhile, imo the longer our Humvees and tanks roll up and down Afghan streets, and our helicopters and fighters and drones patrol Afghan skies, the more we feed the kind of nationalism that will have people turning to the Taliban as a primary tool for driving us out of their country.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: BoolaBoola</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/gingrich-afghanistan-wont-end-well/comment-page-1#comment-123332</link>
		<dc:creator>BoolaBoola</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jul 2010 06:39:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=37092#comment-123332</guid>
		<description>Newt&#039;s problem is he looks and talks like a Ferengi on Star Trek TNG.  Half rat, half toad.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Newt&#8217;s problem is he looks and talks like a Ferengi on Star Trek TNG.  Half rat, half toad.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Watusie</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/gingrich-afghanistan-wont-end-well/comment-page-1#comment-123145</link>
		<dc:creator>Watusie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Jul 2010 21:51:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=37092#comment-123145</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m not buying this stuff about Newt being a massive intellect. He stikes me as being more of a personaltiy-disorder sort of think - like autism, but for politics. Check out this from the NYT Magazine profile last year:

&lt;blockquote&gt;Another frequent recipient is Paul Ryan, a young Wisconsin congressman and Gingrich protégé known for burrowing into budget issues. Ryan told me he was opening presents with his children on Christmas when his BlackBerry buzzed with a question about the tax code. “He’s a total idea factory,” Ryan said. “The man will have 10 ideas in an hour. Six of them will be brilliant, two of them are in the stratosphere and two of them I’ll just flat-out disagree with. And then you’ll get 10 more ideas in the next hour.”&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Got that? A man so out of step with normality that he is pestering colleagues with nonsense on Christmas Day.

Not pretty.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m not buying this stuff about Newt being a massive intellect. He stikes me as being more of a personaltiy-disorder sort of think &#8211; like autism, but for politics. Check out this from the NYT Magazine profile last year:</p>
<p>Another frequent recipient is Paul Ryan, a young Wisconsin congressman and Gingrich protégé known for burrowing into budget issues. Ryan told me he was opening presents with his children on Christmas when his BlackBerry buzzed with a question about the tax code. “He’s a total idea factory,” Ryan said. “The man will have 10 ideas in an hour. Six of them will be brilliant, two of them are in the stratosphere and two of them I’ll just flat-out disagree with. And then you’ll get 10 more ideas in the next hour.”</p>
<p>Got that? A man so out of step with normality that he is pestering colleagues with nonsense on Christmas Day.</p>
<p>Not pretty.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: easton</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/gingrich-afghanistan-wont-end-well/comment-page-1#comment-123133</link>
		<dc:creator>easton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Jul 2010 21:33:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=37092#comment-123133</guid>
		<description>When the former speaker of the House visits Iowa, it is news

Why? What is Dennis Hastert doing, does anyone care? Gingrich was Speaker for a pathetically short period of 4 years, Hastert for 8. Tom Foley was speaker for nearly 6, why is there not news about what he says? Gingrich only gets exposure because he keeps pretending he will run for President, but he never will.

Olkskool, damn right. The Bush&#039;s administration of the war in Afghanistan was downright obscene, borderline treasonous. Imagine after Pearl Harbor we made some half hearted effort to confront the axis, but instead invaded Argentina. This myth of Afghan invincibility these Republicans believe in is crackpot. We let Osama waltz out of Afghanistan because Rumsfeld wanted to show how to win a war without soldiers. Rumsfeld then proceeded to royally screw up Iraq, only after the Democrats took Congress that Bush finally faced reality and dumped that pathetic egoist and brought in professionals.

As to Afghanistan, LFC is right, we don&#039;t need to rebuild the country or turn it into Switzerland, we need only prevent the Taliban and Al Qaeda from retaking the country. Lets not forget the Pashtun Taliban represent only a small portion of the population, the remaining minorities are not part of that group. Most of the fighting and dying we endure is in the Pashtun south. I wish we would risk arming the other minorities, but I understand the reluctance of Generals to have armies not under their own control.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When the former speaker of the House visits Iowa, it is news</p>
<p>Why? What is Dennis Hastert doing, does anyone care? Gingrich was Speaker for a pathetically short period of 4 years, Hastert for 8. Tom Foley was speaker for nearly 6, why is there not news about what he says? Gingrich only gets exposure because he keeps pretending he will run for President, but he never will.</p>
<p>Olkskool, damn right. The Bush&#8217;s administration of the war in Afghanistan was downright obscene, borderline treasonous. Imagine after Pearl Harbor we made some half hearted effort to confront the axis, but instead invaded Argentina. This myth of Afghan invincibility these Republicans believe in is crackpot. We let Osama waltz out of Afghanistan because Rumsfeld wanted to show how to win a war without soldiers. Rumsfeld then proceeded to royally screw up Iraq, only after the Democrats took Congress that Bush finally faced reality and dumped that pathetic egoist and brought in professionals.</p>
<p>As to Afghanistan, LFC is right, we don&#8217;t need to rebuild the country or turn it into Switzerland, we need only prevent the Taliban and Al Qaeda from retaking the country. Lets not forget the Pashtun Taliban represent only a small portion of the population, the remaining minorities are not part of that group. Most of the fighting and dying we endure is in the Pashtun south. I wish we would risk arming the other minorities, but I understand the reluctance of Generals to have armies not under their own control.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: DFL</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/gingrich-afghanistan-wont-end-well/comment-page-1#comment-123119</link>
		<dc:creator>DFL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Jul 2010 20:55:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=37092#comment-123119</guid>
		<description>Iraq was about George Bush&#039;s messianic mission to force democracy and the American Way on the Middle East no matter whether those people wanted it or not.  He was Nathan Scharansky with an adopted Texas twang and a caricature of Texas mannerisms.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Iraq was about George Bush&#8217;s messianic mission to force democracy and the American Way on the Middle East no matter whether those people wanted it or not.  He was Nathan Scharansky with an adopted Texas twang and a caricature of Texas mannerisms.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Oldskool</title>
		<link>http://www.frumforum.com/gingrich-afghanistan-wont-end-well/comment-page-1#comment-123113</link>
		<dc:creator>Oldskool</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Jul 2010 20:46:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumforum.com/?p=37092#comment-123113</guid>
		<description>&lt;BLOCKQUOTE&gt;For better or worse, the Bush administration policy was to engage AQ in Iraq, not in Afghanistan. The Bush administration deliberately kept a small military footprint in Afghanistan. Bush’s Iraq surge appears to have been successful, or at least as successful as a limited war can be. &lt;/BLOCKQUOTE&gt;

That&#039;s crazy talk. Iraq was about many nonsensical things but chasing al-queada wasn&#039;t one of them. I&#039;m talking about reality. As a matter of talking  points, sure; 911, wmd, they were going to nuke us, yellowcake, aluminum cylinders, mobile something-or-another weapons, etc. 

Matter of fact, if we had not invaded Iraq, Afghanistan would likely be over and done with. We had everything going for us when the Bush genuises moved on to greener pastures.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For better or worse, the Bush administration policy was to engage AQ in Iraq, not in Afghanistan. The Bush administration deliberately kept a small military footprint in Afghanistan. Bush’s Iraq surge appears to have been successful, or at least as successful as a limited war can be. </p>
<p>That&#8217;s crazy talk. Iraq was about many nonsensical things but chasing al-queada wasn&#8217;t one of them. I&#8217;m talking about reality. As a matter of talking  points, sure; 911, wmd, they were going to nuke us, yellowcake, aluminum cylinders, mobile something-or-another weapons, etc. </p>
<p>Matter of fact, if we had not invaded Iraq, Afghanistan would likely be over and done with. We had everything going for us when the Bush genuises moved on to greener pastures.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>

