The January Commentary promises to explain “why Jews hate Palin” by staff contributor Jennifer Rubin.
Rubin passes lightly over the question whether Jews in fact do hate Palin more than other people do. The sole evidence she cites on behalf of her assertion is a September 2008 poll in which Jews disapproved of Palin by a 54-37 margin. That does not look like foaming hatred to me, and anyway those numbers are now 15 months out of date.
Besides: Lots of people dislike Sarah Palin. Palin excites intense support among a core group of conservative Republicans. Beyond that base, she is one of the most unpopular figures in modern American life. She polls poorly among the young, among women, among independents. A plurality even of Republican women regard her as unqualified for the presidency.
So if Jews do “hate” Palin, this may be just another manifestation of the old rule about Jews being like other people, only more so.
Still, if the question is to be put anywhere, Commentary is the right place to do it. It’s a magazine with a special mission to explain the Jewish community to itself. So – Jew to Jew, Commentary contributor to Commentary contributor – I’ll join Rubin’s thinking exercise.
Rubin offers four general grounds of explanation for Jewish anti-Palin feeling.
First, says Rubin, Jews greatly value (and possibly over-value) formal credentials.
Jews, who have excelled at intellectual pursuits, understandably are swayed by the notion that the presidency is a knowledge-based position requiring a background in the examination of detailed data and sophisticated analysis. They assume that such knowledge is the special preserve of a certain type of credentialed thinker (the better the university, the more unquestioned the credential) and that possessing this knowledge is the key to a successful presidency.
Second, Rubin continues, Jews under-value traditional American folkways: hunting, fishing, the frontier, military enlistment.
Her personal life made her even more alien to American Jews. She comes from the wilderness, brags about hunting and eating native animals, and is a proud gun owner. … Palin’s oldest, Track, has joined the military, while many Jews lack a family military tradition.
Third, Jews disdain working class occupations like those in which Palin labored.
Palin and her husband had labored at jobs most professional and upper-middle-class Jews would never dream of holding—waitressing, picking “strawberries in the mud and mosquitoes . . . for five cents flat,” sweeping parking lots, and many “messy, obscure seafood jobs, including long shifts on a stinky shore-based crab-processing vessel.” Her populist appeal and identification with working-class voters are rooted in a life experience that is removed by one or two generations from the lives of most American Jews. Her life is what they were expected to rise above.
Fourth and last, Jews hate Palin because Jews disapprove of large families – and especially because Jews quietly favor the abortion of disabled children.
Pro-life Americans saw Palin’s son Trig, born with Down syndrome in April 2008, as an affirmation of Palin’s deeply held beliefs, a rare instance in which a politician did more than mouth platitudes about a “culture of life.” But in affluent communities with large Jewish populations, Down-syndrome children are now largely absent due to the widespread use of diagnostic testing and “genetics counseling.” Trig was not a selling point with many Jewish women who couldn’t imagine making a similar choice—indeed, many have, in fact, made the opposite one.
These reasons are not all wrong, exactly. (Although they contain much that is wrong. Jews despise large families? How then did Bobby Kennedy’s popularity among Jews manage to survive?)
It’s more that Rubin’s reasons in their wrongness inadvertently reveal many of the real reasons for Jewish disquiet about Sarah Palin.
Let’s start with the cagily phrased claim that Palin “identifies with” working class voters. Obviously nobody can know what goes on inside Palin’s head. But if it’s meant to suggest that Palin actually originates in the working class, well that’s flat-out wrong by almost any definition.
Palin’s father was a high school teacher, her mother a public school administrator. Her mother’s brother was a lawyer, an official of the Texas state bar, and later a judge. In a state where many workers had to fear seasonal unemployment, her family enjoyed the security of a public-sector white-collar salary, benefits, and pension. The Heaths were not rich, but they were comfortable and respectable – much more so than, say, the family of young Bill Clinton, who if I remember right, did quite OK among Jews.
To itemize Palin’s summer jobs as proof of her blue-collar authenticity reminds me of that Saturday Night Live sketch in which Al Franken’s Pat Robertson insists he is much more than a TV preacher. “I worked as a caddy, I’ve watched people’s houses ….”
Yes, Todd belonged to a union. So did Ronald Reagan. However: Even before Sarah Palin’s book deal, the Palins ranked among the richest people in their hometown of Wasilla – and were capable of expressing intense disdain toward their perceived social inferiors, like the Johnston clan. If anything, the Palin family’s status grievances look less like Richard Nixon style resentment of poverty and humiliation – and much more like John Adams’ fury on encountering in London those English snobs who didn’t realize what big deals the Adamses were, back home in Braintree.
But in endorsing the fiction about Palin’s hard-scrabble origins, Rubin also endorses some not so innocent fiction about Jews as hostile aliens within America. If Jews dislike Palin, it is because they feel themselves “above” regular Americans – because disdain to work with their hands – because they do not bear their fair share of military service – because they abort Down’s syndrome babies – because they confuse mere verbal fluency with practical wisdom. (I remember that Russell Kirk once flung this accusation against American Jews – and how passionately and rightly the editors of Commentary resented it as a “bloody outrage.”)
And this I think brings us to some of the true reasons for the Jewish disquiet with Palin.
Rubin’s first point has merit to it: Jews do think that knowledge is important to a president. They do think a president should be able to think clearly and to distinguish between true information and wishful delusions. I feel sure most Americans of all faiths would agree. Does Jennifer Rubin seriously suggest that this opinion is mistaken?
If American Jews have a problem with Palin, Rubin is right that problem 1 is that they – we – doubt her intellectual capacity for the job. But that’s only the start of the list of problems.
Ignorance is bad. But we all start ignorant. Jews – again like other people, only more so – expect their leaders to start early and to work hard to remedy their ignorance, by learning things. People who don’t, won’t or can’t learn – whose followers disparage the value or need to learn – are going to forfeit Jewish support, and not only Jewish support.
But even this is not the worst of it. Just guessing, but I think the real and most fundamental problem Jews have with Palin is not her gleeful ignorance, but her willful divisiveness. More than any politician in memory, Palin seems to divide her fellow-Americans into first class and second class citizens, real Americans and not-so-real Americans. To do her justice, she has never said anything to suggest that Jews as Jews fall into the second, less-real, class. But Jews do tend to have an intuition that when this sort of line-drawing is done, we are likely to find ourselves on the wrong side.
58 responses so far
1 sinz54 // Jan 4, 2010 at 2:27 pm
You left out the biggest reason of all:
Jews are overwhelmingly liberal and secular in their political orientation. Most Jews were leftists, and still are liberals. Jews have voted overwhelmingly Democratic in every Presidential election except 1980. Sarah Palin’s political conservatism is alien to them. They wouldn’t vote for any conservative, male or female.
Plus, Sarah Palin appears to be catering to the Religious Right part of the GOP. That’s the part that thinks that America is a “Christian nation.” Jews know that historically, they didn’t do well in nations whose governments considered themselves duty bound to enforce Christianity. Jews believe, with some justification, that they did well in America precisely because the Constitution does not enforce an official religion.
Jews don’t want to be treated as guests of a Christian government. (Guests can always be asked to leave at some point.) They want to be seen as equals of the Christians, by a secular government.
2 Chekote // Jan 4, 2010 at 2:39 pm
Sinz
You nailed it. I really don’t believe that diviseness have anything to do with people’s dislike of Palin. She is disliked by all because she wears her ignorance as a badge of honor. She is disliked because she is seen as the candidate of the religious right.
3 chicago_guy // Jan 4, 2010 at 3:00 pm
I know enough Jewish plumbers, carpenters, musicians and others who make their living combining their training with their manual skills to give the lie to the “Jews hate manual labor” argument. Maybe they just abhor FAILURE at a career, which would seem to characterize Palin ’s less than successful business career prior to becoming the GOP it girl.
Jewish tradition exalts education and the attainment of wisdom, that’s true; I think you could stop right there, since Palin’s ideology eschews education as being “elitist” and thinks wisdom is native (some is, some isn’t). Curious as to how Asian-Americans view Palin, as they also have a culture that embraces education.
Truth is, Palin polls best in parts of the country with the worst school systems and the lowest numbers of residents with college degrees. Take that however you want it, but that’s the way it is.
4 rbottoms // Jan 4, 2010 at 3:11 pm
That whole rooting for the Rapture and the destruction of Israel by the Anti-Christ probably doesn’t endear her to them too much.
5 Elvis Elvisberg // Jan 4, 2010 at 3:19 pm
This is a side issue, and I won’t put words in your mouth and get upset about them. But if I’m reading you right, you seem to view Richard Nixon’s “resentment of poverty and humiliation,” as somehow admirable or at least politically useful. I feel compelled to point out that that social attitude included, unsurprisingly if not inevitably, dislike of Jews:
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1058/is_6_119/ai_84434041/
6 COProgressive // Jan 4, 2010 at 4:08 pm
sinz54 @ 1 says:
“Jews are overwhelmingly liberal and secular in their political orientation. Most Jews were leftists, and still are liberals.”
Hummm. Would you include names like Neo-Nitwits Donald Kagan, Norman Podhoretz, Steven P. Rosen, Paul Wolfowitz, Elliot Abrams, Eliot Cohen, Aaron Friedburg, Robert Kagan, Robert B.Zoellick, and the real Sarah Palin hater William Kristol into the leftist Jews label too?
7 Cforchange // Jan 4, 2010 at 4:22 pm
Willful divisiveness is what turned me permanently 100% off. Engaging the willful divisiveness strategy was chilling and I’m not Jewish.
Pitching patriotism with a wink and smile while stirring the vicious pot is a sales tactic the GOP should not revisit.
8 ConArtist // Jan 4, 2010 at 5:09 pm
A little deep for a Sarah Palin post, eh? Isn’t it simply because she’s an idiot? I think you can postulate a hundred more reasons why Jews hate Palin but it’s probably no deeper than she riles up the crazies and that’s rarely good for minorities.
9 brandon // Jan 4, 2010 at 5:45 pm
Why American Jews continue to be so liberal is a very perplexing subject. Norman Podhoretz has written the definitive book on this topic called “Why Are Jews Liberal?” Conservative Jewish columnist and radio host Dennis Prager also frequently discusses this topic.
What is weird is that no group of people are more pro Israel than American Evangelicals. As an Orthodox Jewish friend of mine likes to say, there are only two groups of people in the world who believe the Torah to be fact, Orthodox Jews and Evangelical Christians.
10 JeninCT // Jan 4, 2010 at 5:45 pm
I agree with sinz54, however I just have to add that I’m tired of the Jews and other groups being labeled as haters of anyone or anything. Tone down the rhetoric before I completely lose respect for you and your site.
11 BoolaBoola // Jan 4, 2010 at 6:24 pm
Let’s get serious. Jews hate Sarah Palin because Jews are smart and Palin is, well, if she is sane enough to be labelled “smart” or “stupid”, then she’s stupid. But more likely she’s just crazy.
12 Jews, David Frum, Sarah Palin « Antisemitica // Jan 4, 2010 at 6:34 pm
[...] 4, 2010 by Hunter Wallace David Frum has responded to Jennifer Rubin’s article on Jews hating Sarah Palin. In Frum’s view, Jews dislike [...]
13 tdawg11870 // Jan 4, 2010 at 6:59 pm
Oh, Commentary. They’ve been tilting at windmills for years, explaining patiently how their fellow Jews have it wrong and they should be conservative. The majority of American Jewry hasn’t bought it. Norman Podhoretz can write a book ascribing all manner of imagined psychological ailments and longstanding misunderstandings to his people, but it doesn’t do anything.
Every presidential election year, a consensus forms in Republican circles that *this* will be the year that Jews go for the big R, usually because of a perceived strength on Israel based mainly on the quantity of belligerent rhetoric. It never works.
Plus, Jews belong to other demographics that inform our political opinions. We are more likely to live in cities or inner suburbs. We are more likely to have postgraduate degrees. We are more likely to have a strong immigrant narrative in our families. All of these things make people more liberal, and Jews are no different.
Jews “hate” Palin because she’s conservative and Jews are generally not conservative. I’m sure Podhoretz, Kristol and Perle don’t poll so well among Jews either.
14 balconesfault // Jan 4, 2010 at 7:27 pm
Jen: Tone down the rhetoric before I completely lose respect for you and your site.
Well, to be fair, David was simply repeating the charge being made by Rubin in Commentary.
Although I agree with you – the term itself is inflammatory and insulting to Jews.
While not Jewish, I’m very involved in my local Jewish community – and I’d say that the proper terminology would be disrespect, or perhaps disdain – but not hatred. I don’t think that Jews summon up the emotion for Palin that hatred requires.
15 sinz54 // Jan 4, 2010 at 8:09 pm
COProgressive:
Those particular Jewish conservatives you named, have almost no following within the larger Jewish community. In 2004, Jews voted for Kerry over Bush by a remarkable 3-to-1 margin:
http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2004/pages/results/states/US/P/00/epolls.0.html
16 sinz54 // Jan 4, 2010 at 8:31 pm
brandon:
It’s not perplexing to me at all.
For centuries, Jews had been intimidated, persecuted, and even murdered, in almost every nation whose regime was expressly dedicated to spreading Christianity.
Jews feel that the United States has been good to them, precisely because its government is NOT dedicated to spreading Christianity, but instead respects all faiths.
And they’re right.
The Religious Right, while supportive of the state of Israel, persists in thinking of America as a Christian nation in which Jews are a tolerated minority. That’s not what Jews have ever been satisfied with. Jews had that setup in other countries–until the Christians stopped being so tolerant, after which the Jews were in big trouble.
In America, Jews have always advocated for secularism–in politics, in the arts, in academia–because they see secularism as their best safeguard against having to flee America someday like they had to flee Spain, Russia, Germany, etc. etc. etc.
And they’re right.
A nation that has accepted the principle that your faith is your own business, isn’t likely to turn on Jews as “Christ-killers” someday.
Jews used to be economic socialists too, because Jews worked in the garment industry and other blue-collar industries and had to fight for better wages and working conditions. Their allies were the liberals, socialists, and even Communists–while conservatives generally sided with big business against these workers.
That’s changing, as Jews have become much more affluent and more white-collar in recent decades. In 1980, Reagan managed to get 39% of the Jewish vote, the most ever by a Republican presidential candidate. Any Republican should be able to do at least as well–but not if they keep waving the banners of a “Christian nation.” (In 1980, Reagan did NOT campaign on that.)
So what’s so perplexing?
17 brandon // Jan 4, 2010 at 9:26 pm
The secular Jewish perception of Evangelical Christians is wrong. The stereotype of the so called “religious right” is so far from reality that it is strange that so many people, including many who post here, fall for it.
This article about Jews and Evangelical Christians in City Journal says it far better than I can:
http://www.city-journal.org/2008/18_1_evangelicals.html
18 Arch // Jan 4, 2010 at 9:36 pm
Oh has it been a week since we’ve had a Sarah Palin story? The time just flew by.
19 cathykerr // Jan 5, 2010 at 12:10 am
Does Sarah Palin have any Jewish ancestry? Her grandmother is said to be descended from Lithuanian Jews, although some reports on the web dispute this. Does anyone know the answer?
20 JeninCT // Jan 5, 2010 at 6:30 am
“balconesfault // Jan 4, 2010 at 7:27 pm
Jen: Tone down the rhetoric before I completely lose respect for you and your site.
Well, to be fair, David was simply repeating the charge being made by Rubin in Commentary.”
Sorry, I guess I have a short attention span! I’m not Jewish either. The way race and ethnicity is handled in general is bothersome. We’re not allowed to notice race, ethnicity and gender, unless of course we’re taking a poll and trying to see how certain groups act differently from each other. Then we can talk about the poll all we want and call groups haters!
Doesn’t make any sense to me.
21 tdawg11870 // Jan 5, 2010 at 9:51 am
JeninCT: One of my least favorite “tics” of political discussion/writing is the phrase “we’re not allowed to talk about/notice…” For the right, it’s race. For the left, it’s (sometimes) Israel. By complaining about what you “can’t” talk about, you’re talking about it and the federales aren’t coming to knock down your door and drag you to a reeducation camp.
As a matter of fact, we talk about race all the time, usually in a very unproductive way. We’re doing it now.
22 sinz54 // Jan 5, 2010 at 10:55 am
Arch:
David Frum should not have personalized this issue by bringing Sarah Palin into it.
Palin is less of an evangelical crusader than some other figures in the conservative movement.
The issue transcends Palin. The real issue is how the evangelicals are perceived by other religious minorities–and also how they’re perceived by secularists. The evangelicals are perceived as dangerous to other people’s freedoms.
And the evangelicals should correct that perception.
23 JeninCT // Jan 5, 2010 at 12:36 pm
Tdawg: Yes, I agree with your point, but my point was that we, especially public figures, are really not wise to talk about race, gender and ethnicity honestly; it’s not that we’re ‘not allowed’. Sure the feds aren’t coming after anyone but the lawsuits just might. And even as so many are clamoring for our society to be color-blind and gender-neutral, we keep seeing polls about how different groups think and act, and then the media discussed the polls as news. That’s what frustrates me.
24 DFL // Jan 5, 2010 at 1:09 pm
Sinz, perhaps secularists should correct the perception that they support cultural malaise, moral squalor and social dysfunction. As for your initial post, I would say your analysis was spot on.
25 sdspringy // Jan 5, 2010 at 1:16 pm
Interesting that Frum chooses to raise Palin’s name again. Maybe David is still on vacation, and having no idea what is happening in the world David falls back on his tried and true method to increase comments. PALIN.
Instead of talking about the complete breakdown of US security, nope Palin.
Instead of talking about the lastest secret round of Dems healthcare talks, nope Palin.
Instead of talking about the impending drop in the economy as stimulus ends, nope Palin.
Instead of talking about the financial difficulties the states face, nope Palin
David stop drinking and get back to work.
26 balconesfault // Jan 5, 2010 at 1:51 pm
DFL Sinz, perhaps secularists should correct the perception that they support cultural malaise, moral squalor and social dysfunction.
I can assure you that secularists certainly do not support those things.
On the other hand, I have no doubt that the secularists I know define those terms far differently than many fundamentalists do.
sdspringy
Instead of talking about the complete breakdown of US security
Winner for the most hyperbolic comment of 2010 so far.
I’d say that allowing a coordinated terrorist attack where 19 co-conspirators board 4 different airlines and execute identical tactics in unison to represent a “complete breakdown of US security”.
The underpants bomber? Certainly there were lapses (maybe Obama’s TSA appointee, approved months ago, could have remedied that…) but unless you’re ready to wait for 3 hours every time you board a plane, every half dozen years or so we’re going to have a solo actor slip through the cracks.
Instead of talking about the lastest secret round of Dems healthcare talks
There’s a lot of talk about that. Sheesh.
Instead of talking about the financial difficulties the states face
There was a toppost article on this a couple days ago.
Instead of talking about the impending drop in the economy as stimulus ends
Tell me, sd – how much of the stimulus money do you think has already been spent?
27 sinz54 // Jan 5, 2010 at 2:10 pm
DFL:
They should.
What secularists REALLY should deal with, is the consequences of their moral relativism for this nation.
P.Z. Myers, for example, says bluntly that there are no moral standards; all morality is relative. But relative morality makes it impossible to condemn, much less deter, any acts, even an act as horrific as the 9-11 terrorist attack.
I just don’t understand how any society can survive for long on moral relativism, except by brute force (like Big Brother and IngSoc in George Orwell’s “1984″).
28 balconesfault // Jan 5, 2010 at 2:21 pm
I just don’t understand how any society can survive for long on moral relativism, except by brute force (like Big Brother and IngSoc in George Orwell’s “1984″).
So bring back slavery. Or at least, anti-miscegenation laws. And of course disenfranchise not only the blacks, but women. Make not only homosexuality (or more properly – sodomy) illegal, but birth control as well.
Come on, man – give us that Old Time Religion!
29 Arch // Jan 5, 2010 at 2:49 pm
I’m a secularist and an atheist and don’t feel that’s made me a moral relativist. I don’t need fear of some extra-terrestrial judgment to make me want to do the right thing. Nor do I need a magic book. Empathy and a sense of fairness will take you far. Further, I see all around me immoral acts perpetrated by those with faith either because of their faith, or minimized due to their faith. I used to think religion was fine for those that want it, but I’ve finally reached a point where I believe religion brings more evil than good.
30 mlloyd // Jan 5, 2010 at 3:19 pm
I just don’t understand how any society can survive for long on moral relativism, except by brute force (like Big Brother and IngSoc in George Orwell’s “1984″).
Or through strict imposition of religious morality, as in Iran and Saudi Arabia.
Myers’ recognition that morality is relative doesn’t mean that morals aren’t very important, very deeply felt, or something that shouldn’t be acted on. More importantly, people like him have zero political power in this country. How many atheists are there in elective office in this country? Are there five?
31 JeninCT // Jan 5, 2010 at 4:09 pm
I agree with you Arch. Well said.
32 balconesfault // Jan 5, 2010 at 4:16 pm
How many atheists are there in elective office in this country? Are there five?
Likely there are far more – but of course they’re in elective office in no small part because they don’t publicly declare their atheism. For example, salient to the topic of this thread, I know quite a few Jews who are actually agnostic or even atheist … but who still are culturally Jewish, perhaps not staying kosher and respecting Shabbat, but belonging to a local Jewish Community Center and hosting a Passover Seder and having their kids Bar and Bat Mitzvah’d.
Looping back to the term “social dysfunction”, let me add that if there are atheists and other non-believers who are occupying pews in Christian Churches across America because they believe their presence in church each Sunday is critical to their political or business success – either because of community perceptions or simply as a form of networking – I consider that far more disfunctional than if there are a number of declared atheists in society. Not that churchgoing is socially disfunctional, but any perception that churchgoing is a key step in social advancement is a sign of an unhealthy society.
33 sdspringy // Jan 5, 2010 at 7:59 pm
Balcon:
34 anniemargret // Jan 5, 2010 at 11:00 pm
To me there is nothing mysterious about why Jews (and others) dislike Palin. She is 1) intellectually a lightweight, showing an appalling lack of understanding of world affairs, and 2) she is a divider, not a uniter. She likes to stir the pot to get it to a boiling point, then backs off when challenged and pretends she wouldn’t do that. She is an agitator.
I grew up in NYC and my neighbors and friends were Jewish. From my associations, they overwhelmingly respect intelligence and education. They respect freedom, and I would suspect that Palin’s supposedly religious superiority is offensive, and they dislike disunity.
However, the article should be re-titled as, ‘Why Most Americans Dislike Palin.”
35 brandon // Jan 5, 2010 at 11:18 pm
“So bring back slavery”
Historically, most abolitionist movements were started and led by Christians.
If you want to blame Christian involvement in government for all kinds of evils, then I will match it with such noted atheists as Mao, Stalin and Pol Pot.
Those 3 secularists alone are responsible for the deaths of 69 million people. Us Christians have a long way to go to get into that league of misery.
36 balconesfault // Jan 6, 2010 at 3:34 am
Historically, most abolitionist movements were started and led by Christians.
True. My point, however, was that we do not consider slaveowners like George Washington or Thomas Jefferson to be evil men.
However, if we were informed that someone in the world today was a slaveowner, even in some nation where it was legal, we would consider this to be a sign that they are an evil person.
Or as another example – I have heard people justify the invasion of Iraq, and label Saddam an evil man, in part because he brutally tortured his own people in order to maintain power. However, many of those same people decried the US not sending military support to Iran during their revolution to prevent the overthrow of the Shah – who we were well aware at the time brutally tortured his own people in order to maintain power.
Those, my friend, are all examples of “moral relativism”. If slavery is an absolute evil, it doesn’t matter whether it’s the Chinese Government or George Washington or Abraham using slavery for economic gain. Yet instead we consider the prevailing morality of the time when judging.
37 The Jews and Sarah from Alaska « The Elitist Liberal // Jan 6, 2010 at 1:23 pm
[...] I may have fallen into the right-wing identity politics trap. Props to David Frum for pointing out that the Jewish/Gentile distinction here is a myth and that [...]
38 Stupid Commentary Tricks: ” Why Jews Hate Palin “ « Samurai Mohel // Jan 6, 2010 at 1:32 pm
[...] read through the whole article just the abstract, but the abstract alone is bad enough. David Frum has more, though I don’t agree with most of what he has to say. But I agree that all Jennifer Rubin [...]
39 Palin and the Jews - Ryan Sager - Neuroworld - True/Slant // Jan 6, 2010 at 2:13 pm
[...] Here’s Frum: Jews do think that knowledge is important to a president. They do think a president should be able to think clearly and to distinguish between true information and wishful delusions. I feel sure most Americans of all faiths would agree. Does Jennifer Rubin seriously suggest that this opinion is mistaken? [...]
40 Paul // Jan 6, 2010 at 2:40 pm
This is actually a fascinating discussion b/c it cuts to the heart of opposition to Palin without relying on the more common and lazy generalities that get tossed around.
Frum makes a number of cogent points, but I think when you really boil it down (and this is the least politically correct answer), I do think it comes back to education or lack thereof.
As my conservative, Republican-voting grandmother said about Palin: “The woman went to five colleges in three different states? Very goyisha.”
Just as with the selection of our doctors and our lawyers and our auto mechanics, if Jews are going to throw their lot in with a given political leader, they want to know that said leader is credentialed and experienced and can deliver their service.
Otherwise, we’ll take our business down the block.
41 Freezer Burn « Llamapalooza! // Jan 6, 2010 at 3:13 pm
[...] In the matter of The Jews v. Sarah Palin, David Frum is actually making sense. [...]
42 Why Do Jews Hate Sarah Palin? // Jan 6, 2010 at 4:26 pm
[...] The Jews hate Sarah Palin. (Because they hate Real Americans, is basically her answer.) David Frum rebuts: she is just scary to everyone! Both leave out one hugely important [...]
43 jjv // Jan 6, 2010 at 6:24 pm
I will point out a key weakness in this rebuttal. Jews liked Bobby Kennedy 40 years ago. Abortion and small families is now a marker for Jews in a way it wasn’t then. Mel Brooks could joke that the Protestants left there children with ‘Italians and Jews’you know people who like children” he stated in his act in the 1960’s. The joke would make less sense now. Pro-Life Democrats have a much harder time getting “New York” money than any other kind of Democrat. Second, as Commentary also points out that for a large number of Jews being “anti-Christian” is more important than being Jewish. That is, opposing public expression of the Christian faith is now part of a large group of secular Jews. I think the focus on Governor Palin’s education and intelligence is also misplaced. She is at least as smart as several female Senators who certainly retain Jewish support. I also reject the conceit that Sarah Palin is more “us” v. “them” than other politicians. Howard Dean had enormous Jewish support and constantly denigrated the part of the country represented by Sarah Palin. He was one of the most angry, hate filled candidates since the 1970’s and attracted large swaths of the Jewish vote.
I do agree that Rubin’s statement is unproven. Do Jews “hate” Sarah Palin more than other groups of solidly liberal Americans? I don’t know that that is true. Where is the evidence? It is my experience but it is not evidence.
44 links for 2010-01-06 // Jan 6, 2010 at 7:17 pm
[...] Do Jews Hate Palin? I think the real and most fundamental problem Jews have with Palin is not her gleeful ignorance, but her willful divisiveness. More than any politician in memory, Palin seems to divide her fellow-Americans into first class and second class citizens, real Americans and not-so-real Americans. (tags: politics usa sarahpalin jews nefa) [...]
45 Why Do the Jews Hate Sarah Palin So Much? // Jan 7, 2010 at 1:01 am
[...] The Jews hate Sarah Palin. (Because they hate Real Americans, is basically her answer.) David Frum rebuts: she is just scary to everyone! Both leave out one hugely important [...]
46 1-6-2010 The Day in Review | F i a t Lux // Jan 7, 2010 at 2:15 am
[...] Frum absolutely eviscerates Jennifer Rubin’s Commentary essay explaining “Why Jews Hate [...]
47 Matthew Yglesias » Palin and the Jews // Jan 7, 2010 at 11:29 am
[...] Jennifer Rubin wrote a somewhat bizarre piece about how Jews hate Sarah Palin because we’re bigoted against rural folk (is Wasilla even rural? I had the impression that it’s a suburb) which prompted a good David Frum post. [...]
48 Discussing Sarah Palin Some More: 2010 Edition « Around The Sphere // Jan 7, 2010 at 12:39 pm
[...] David Frum at FrumForum: Let’s start with the cagily phrased claim that Palin “identifies with” working class voters. Obviously nobody can know what goes on inside Palin’s head. But if it’s meant to suggest that Palin actually originates in the working class, well that’s flat-out wrong by almost any definition. [...]
49 JeninCT // Jan 7, 2010 at 12:49 pm
Paul, I think your Grandmother’s comment is fascinating, and it does explain why many people have a problem with Palin: Her college experience. However, from where I stand, her college experience (including her pageant experience to earn college money) speaks more positively about her character than any parent-funded Ivy league education.
50 The “Mystery” of Sarah Palin’s Unpopularity « Little Choward on the Prairie // Jan 7, 2010 at 1:12 pm
[...] in Commentary of why Jews don’t like Sarah Palin. But that would be repetitive, since both David Frum and Matt Yglesias do a fine job of refuting Rubin’s arguments both substantively and [...]
51 anniemargret // Jan 7, 2010 at 5:29 pm
There is a backlash against right wing Christianity. It is not enough that they are able to practice their religion in peace in this country. They want to ‘christianize the government’ or so said an evangelical acquantaince of mine. They support Israel because they believe Christ will return there, and if possible, they would convert every single Jew on the face of of the planet because they fundamentally believe no else is ’saved’ except for them. Their religious superiority comes thru loud and clear. If any other religion would be behaving so, there would be a loud hue and cry from the Christian community.
I am a Roman Catholic. I find this push with Palin and her religious talk (and other Republican religious-talking rhetoric) offensive and dangerous. She is clearly setting up a path to destroy our constitutional liberties of separation of church and state. If ’secular Jews’ are pushing back, I think it’s because they feel the way many Americans do….that the right wing of the Republican party (and Palin fits the description to a T) that these people do not have respect for our religions in this country, or for those who prefer no religion at all, and would, if given the open door, make the highest political office a religious one.
If this doesn’t scare you, why doesn’t it?
Secondly, Jenin: I personally don’t care what college(s) Palin went to (although they hypocrisy here is abundant, given that if Obama had admitted he flitted from college to college his opponents would be nailing him on that too). Most people college-age are not mature enough to know what they need or want.
The truth is that there are a lot of people who never graduated from college, who went to become quite successful in their lives due to hard work and dedication.
And what’s this reference to ‘ive league’ education? You Palinites just love the culture wars, don’t you? I admire anyone who graduated from an Ivy League college, because most people do – nothing wrong or weird in that at all. You admire people who did better in life usually, but with the culture-war crowd, any sign of education or articulation in speaking means you are an ‘elite.’
I graduated, like thousands of others from CUNY, a state funded college system, and my kids graduated from UNC. Thousands of others across our nation graduated from similiar state schools. I took out a Federal loan to get my graduate degree and worked two jobs to pay it back, as did millions of others. So what? It means nothing.
What most people have criticized Palin for is lack of insight and overall education in the understanding of the intricacies of national and international issues that are so important to our nation and our citizens, that it should be basic material for any Presidential candidate to express.
Palin has shown an appalling lack of understanding, and an even more appalling lack of basic knowledge for the job. We all know what those are. If your standard for the presidency is culture wars, you will lose….every time. Outside of Palin’s tight fan base, no one cares about them. There are enormous issues facing Americans these days; we got better things to worry about.
And a higher standard of basic education and ability for the presidency.
52 Why Jews Like Me Hate Sarah Palin | Jewschool // Jan 7, 2010 at 8:19 pm
[...] Frum’s response points out that Palin is just scary to anybody who doesn’t want to see American divided into [...]
53 JeninCT // Jan 8, 2010 at 12:10 pm
Annie: ” Secondly, Jenin: I personally don’t care what college(s) Palin went to ”
I never said you did. I was referring to the quote from Paul’s grandmother. Your first clue might have been that I addressed the post to him.
“And what’s this reference to ‘ive league’ education? You Palinites just love the culture wars, don’t you? I admire anyone who graduated from an Ivy League college, because most people do – nothing wrong or weird in that at all. You admire people who did better in life usually, but with the culture-war crowd, any sign of education or articulation in speaking means you are an ‘elite.’”
I referred specifically to ‘parent-funded’ Ivy league educations, as opposed to those that are paid for by the students themselves. And your comment about the culture war crowd is a giant assumption. Don’t put words in my mouth.
We know you dislike Palin; move on.
54 dragonlady // Jan 9, 2010 at 1:15 pm
Frum said: “Just guessing, but I think the real and most fundamental problem Jews have with Palin is not her gleeful ignorance, but her willful divisiveness. More than any politician in memory, Palin seems to divide her fellow-Americans into first class and second class citizens, real Americans and not-so-real Americans.”
Frum is not providing the context and thus, not wholly accurate on Palin. It is true she was in attack-mode during the campaign. However, that is not uncommon for the VP candidate so the Pres candidate can appear to be above that sort of fray. As a governor, she was not divisive nor did she put lot of emphasis on cultural and social issues. It really was the media that tagged her a country bumpkin stupid bible-thumper on a some sort of crusade. That impression was immediately cemented among secular liberals who are suspicious and disdainful of anyone who is a religious Christian.
Whether Jews dislike her more than others, I can’t really say I’ve seen evidence of that. But there is a much more visceral deeper emotion it seems for folks who dislike Palin that goes beyond the she’s not intellectually qualified argument. I haven’t really placed it yet but it’s almost like they see her as somewhat alien and anathema to who should be in the political elite.
Not trying to convince anyone to like or not–don’t care if you do. Just pointing out Frum selectively chooses to highlight what he considers her worst qualities and ignores why she does appeal to the GOP base. He has a tin ear to what matters to the base and as such, can’t put forth an effective political strategy to co-op them along with moderates under one tent.
It’s not that there is anything wrong with being elite. But when the elites seem to be unable to govern (and I say this for both parties) and out-of-touch, and on top of that, condescending with a we-know-best-attitude, people are rightfully resentful. This Jacksonian attitude is nothing new in American political history and tends to come back with a vengenance when the elites appear particularly corrupt and inept (Wall St anyone? DC anyone?). Having skepticism of the elites is also nothing new among conservative intellectuals, like William Buckley, either.
55 JeninCT // Jan 9, 2010 at 11:01 pm
Terrific post, Dragonlady. I agree.
56 pepster // Jan 12, 2010 at 1:56 pm
David,
Jennifer Rubins arguments are silly. You did a fine job in countering with infinetely sillier arguments.
“Yes, Todd belonged to a Union, but so did Reagan” Huh? A commercial fisherman and North Slope Oil worker can only be described as working class. Are you serious? Todd Palin doesn’t have working class background? That is plain dishonest.
“The Heaths were not rich, but they were comfortable and respectable” You can’t be comfortable, respectable AND working class? You ought to examine your prejudices. It is amazing that you believe that some how respect and working class don’t go together. You ought to be ashamed.
Working on a fishing boat is hard, back breaking work. Anyone who has done that has at least some exposure to the “working class”. Many salmon boat captains in Alaska are teachers. The salmon run in the summer and teachers have the summers off. I’ve worked on those boats. Bill Clinton’s mother was a nurse and stepfather owned a car dealership. That qualifies as working class roots. But a School teacher doesn’t.
Until her book deal the Palin’s were not millionaires. That said, that people with blue collar roots can become “among the richest residents of Wasilla” isn’t something that would surpise anyone who lived there. I grew up there so it does not surprise me. Maybe that type of thing doesn’t happen back east.
57 Occidental Dissent » Blog Archive » Jews reserve the exclusive right to explain Jew, everyone else are anti-semites // Jan 19, 2010 at 1:08 pm
[...] was looking at Hunter’s post about David Frum, and noticed this very interesting Frum quote: So if Jews do “hate” Palin, this may be just [...]
58 Aapii.org » Blog Archive » Why Do Jews Hate Sarah Palin? // Feb 19, 2010 at 10:28 pm
[...] The Jews hate Sarah Palin. (Because they hate Real Americans, is basically her answer.) David Frum rebuts: she is just scary to everyone! Both leave out one hugely important [...]
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