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Look, I know that it’s urgent that we all pretend to believe that the Boehner plan represents a famous victory for fiscal conservatism. My question probably comes under the heading of “too soon.” But …
… should the Boehner plan become law, what exactly has this debt ceiling showdown accomplished that could not have been accomplished through the ordinary budget process?
I count arguably one thing: the $1 billion cut to discretionary spending in the current year.
Beyond that:
True, the Boehner plan does not raise taxes. But so what? The Bush tax cuts will still expire at the end of 2012, the tax increases in the Affordable Care Act will still kick in. The chest-thumping about “no tax increases” does not alter any of those pre-programmed facts.
The Boehner plan will do nothing to slow spending in Medicaid, Medicare, and Social Security. The Republicans brushed aside as empty talk President Obama’s offers on entitlements. Maybe they were right about Obama. But their own plan gains nothing on those issues.
The Boehner plan promises to identify big cuts in discretionary spending over the next nine years. But wait a minute. Discretionary spending is appropriated spending. Congress can cut appropriations through the budget process anytime it wants. Why not just … do it? How is it a big win to declare a commitment to do it over a decade to come?
The answer to that last is that the ordinary budget process requires some cooperation with the Senate and the president. And it was that cooperation that stuck in House Republicans’ craw. The big benefit of the Boehner plan is that it is seen to be imposed – and the current GOP mindset is that it’s better to gain less by show of force than to get more by negotiation.
“Discretionary spending is appropriated spending. Congress can cut appropriations through the budget process anytime it wants. Why not just … do it?”
Under the Boehner plan there is a reason to hold wavering legislators feet to the fire. When Democrats attack-if the President is forced to sign this-spending cutting Republicans will be able to point to his signature. That is a much bigger thing than you have calcualted.
It also does not get us past the next election. This will be before the country again in an election year and the GOP still holds an edge over Democrats on who are the more wasteful spenders.
“This will be before the country again in an election year…”
At what cost to the country? Jesus Christ.
That’s not a bug – it’s a feature.
The only way a Republican can defeat Barack Obama in 2012 is if the US economy is in ruins on election day. They’re working on that as hard as they can.
That’s an awful lot of words just to say Republicans are assholes.
Ironic choice for a title…Might do the GOP some good to read this before “declaring victory”. (Read the last stanza)
The Battle of Blenheim
by Robert Southey
It was a summer evening;
Old Kaspar’s work was done,
And he before his cottage door
Was sitting in the sun;
And by him sported on the green
His little grandchild Wilhelmine.
She saw her brother Peterkin
Roll something large and round,
Which he beside the rivulet
In playing there had found.
He came to ask what he had found,
That was so large, and smooth, and round.
Old Kaspar took it from the boy,
Who stood expectant by;
And then the old man shook his head,
And with a natural sigh,
“‘Tis some poor fellow’s skull,” said he,
“Who fell in the great victory.
“I find them in the garden,
For there’s many here about;
And often, when I go to plow,
The plowshare turns them out;
For many thousand men,” said he,
“Were slain in that great victory.”
“Now tell us what ‘twas all about,”
Young Peterkin, he cries;
And little Wilhelmine looks up
With wonder-waiting eyes;
“Now tell us all about the war,
And what they fought each other for.”
“It was the English,” Kaspar cried,
“Who put the French to rout;
But what they fought each other for,
I could not well make out;
But everybody said,” quoth he,
“That ‘twas a famous victory.
“My father lived at Blenheim then,
Yon little stream hard by;
They burnt his dwelling to the ground,
And he was forced to fly;
So with his wife and child he fled,
Nor had he where to rest his head.
“With fire and sword the country round
Was wasted far and wide,
And many a childing mother then,
And new-born baby, died;
But things like that, you know, must be
At every famous victory.
“They say it was a shocking sight
After the field was won;
For many thousand bodies here
Lay rotting in the sun;
But things like that, you know, must be
After a famous victory.
“Great praise the Duke of Marlboro’ won,
And our good Prince Eugene.”
“Why, ‘twas a very wicked thing!”
Said little Wilhelmine.
“Nay, nay, my little girl,” quoth he;
“It was a famous victory.
“And everybody praised the Duke
Who this great fight did win.”
“But what good came of it at last?”
Quoth little Peterkin.
“Why, that I cannot tell,” said he;
“But ‘twas a famous victory.”
You think the debt ceiling debate has been bad so far? Wait until we redo this in an election year… it’s going to be ugly with Cantor, Ryan, and the young guns vs. the president, while the GOP nominee gets to sit around campaigning freely. Wow, next year is going to be brutally ugly, just wait.
If Ryan’s budget increases spending by 5 trillion over 10 years what is this plan about and if the GOP in Ryan’s plan wish to increase spending by 5 trillion does that not need a deficit ceiling increase 4 times over at least.
It all seems schizophrenic to me.
Yet more proof (as if we didn’t have tons already) that Republicans have not been fiscal conservatives in at least the last 30 years. It’s so bad now that they don’t even try to “play one on TV.”
Obama is going to campaign on, do you really want these crazy mother******s running the world or me?
+1 LOL
Normally, I am not in agreement with how rbottoms words things but I have to say, exactly. They’ve handed Obama the presidency with this stunt. Boehner’s plan only confirms it.
There is way out for the Republicans. Forget the Tea Party and craft a bill that appeals to the middle of the Party and the Democrats. It passes and Boehner can take credit for saving the country. Then he asks the Democrats to compromise and a real effort is made craft a long term solution. Both parties should forget they have radical wing. The rational live in the middle, they are adults and learned along time ago that you can not get everything you want.
Wait a sec, I had tuned out over the past couple days due to work issues…. You mean to tell me that the GOP rejected Obama’s $4 trillion dollar deal, and came back with a deal containing only $1 billion in budget cuts this year? And they want to call that a win?
Hell, they could save that much by turning the thermostats in Afghanistan up by half a degree.
Pretty much. The “fiscal conservatives” decided that they’d rather support a bill with less cuts than one that makes much larger cuts but increases revenues slightly. However, now it appears that even the Boehner $1 trillion cut won’t make it through since certain tea party reps are all too happy to force a default unless they get their cut, cap, and balance bill which has no support outside of the hardcore elements of the GOP.
The New PLO | Library Grape // Jul 27, 2011 at 5:04 pm
[...] Frum wonders why a putatively small-government party has left trillions of spending cuts on the shelf: The answer to that last is that the ordinary budget process requires some cooperation with the [...]
“holds an edge over Democrats on who are the more wasteful spenders.”
Exactly how? Bush ran bigger deficits than Clinton and that is not counting TARP whichwas under him.
Contrary to JJV’s political scheming, the American people don’t want to go through this again in a few months. Businesses have been stockpiling money, not expanding or buying new equipment or hiring because of the uncertainty that Congress has created these last 7 months since the GOP took over the House. The DJIA closed down to 12,302 today. Last Thursday the DJIA was almost 16,700. Fund managers and analysts are recommending their customers cash out and not invest until the debt ceiling is resolved. And that’s just the peak of the downside of this artifical, self-induced crisis that will negatively every US family, business, state and community.
JJV, this is not a game! It has long term serious negative consequences for the United States. I am thoroughly dismayed that you do not see that fact and are “egging” on right wing Tea Party GOP.
Here’s a link to a letter to John Boehner from a [i]real[/] conservative Republican: http://www.coffeepartyusa.com/dear-boehner
I suggest you read it and learn a thing or two about real conservativism as well as responsibility to the country first and party second.
As a small businessman watching my sales plummet during this uncertain economic environment I find this farce that is being played out in Washington disgusting. After all of the anguish over these many months where the arguments have been made over and over again, nothing positive of significance is accomplished. The policy incompetence of the Washington elite is beyond stunning.
While we have been distracted by the kabuki dance, the needs of the nation have been ignored. We still have millions unemployed, millions lacking access to reasonable health care, failing schools, crumbling infrastructure, a growing income and wealth inequality that is a cancer in our national soul, and so forth. China, Brazil, India and others are growing their economies and strengthening their international competitive positions while we twiddle our fingers and refuse to deal with reality.
At 75 years of age I have lived through many crises in our nation, some of which were existential, but I don’t recall a time when we have intentionally created a self-inflicted crisis as hurtful and damaging to so many citizens as we have done this year.
Now we have the Republicans who after walking away from a potential $4 trillion package to address the deficit because it contained some revenue increases (increases that most reasonable qualified observers say are necessary) proposing a $1 trillion cut over 10 years so they can claim a political victory and embarrass the president, a victory that will insure the resumption of this farcical effort a few months down the road.
While the needy and the vulnerable are targeted for cuts in services and support, the job creators (who don’t create jobs) are protected from the obligation to participate in some small way in helping to heal the economy. Our legislators, most of whom are millionaires, sit in their comfortable offices protected from the negative consequences of their policies.
Their biggest risk is that they might lose an election and have to move down the street to a well paid position with a lobbying firm.
What a country!
I agree with many of your points. The business I run has had the breaks on hiring for the last couple years since demand fell flat and sales hit a long sustained ditch. Things appear to be pulling out of the ditch slowly, but I feel that the House has done the worst possible thing considering the situation we’re in: they’ve purposefully denigrated the prestige of the national economy and purposefully degraded business and consumer confidence. I’m in shock that this kind of behavior doesn’t necessarily result in a public shaming or even light reprimand from the majority of voters in their districts. They’ve manufactured an insulating bubble of ignorant ideologues to use as their permanent voting base. These are scary times.
There is no public shaming because the conservatives control the media, even the so-called liberal mainstream media. In order to appear unbiased, they have to employ false equivalencies of “both sides do it” or act merely as an echo chamber by reporting what one side “says” instead of doing any kind of critical analysis to show that it’s a load of hooey.
Republicans routinely are on the Sunday talk shows on TV and they control the message. They don’t even need Fox News to control the message. Obama has the bully pulpit – every speech he makes commands attention. But he hasn’t used it to any advantage, to educate the populace about what is going on. And part of that is because he probably believes a lot of the bullshit that Wall Street economists and lobbyists tell him. He keeps acquiescing to how the right frames the debate instead of forcing people to think about what exactly it is that is really going on.
The game is rigged and teatards have the advantage, because the head teatards have the money to control the framing of the message.
They are crazy and the FACT that this is all about hurting Obama is sinking in, even in traditionally Republican areas, and in a big way with businessmen and women. Try being aan investment advisor or realtor in this environment. I have always said the Tea Party would destroy the Republican Party – it’s coming through.
Hurting Obama my ass.
In six months, closer to election time, he gets to do this again and remind people why they should dump the Tea Baggers on their ass.
“Bre’er Fox, please don’t throw me in dat briar patch over there!”
The Br’er Rabbit line made me laugh so hard I almost choked. It’s an apt tactical comparison, to say the least.
medinnus +1
“Maybe they were right about Obama. But their own plan gains nothing on those issues.”
I wish they had explored the possibility for a grand bargain in good faith instead of pissing on Obama’s head at every turn. It would have been better for the country and better for their own stated ideological goals as well.
“The big benefit of the Boehner plan is that it is seen to be IMPOSED…”
Spot on. After all that talk of Obama ramming his healthcare proposal down our throats (through civilized debate and the majority vote of the entire country’s elected representatives), what are we to make of the current Republican behavior? I don’t believe there is any other instance like this during my lifetime. We have a majority in only 1 of 2 representative bodies ramming an extreme ideological statement down the country’s throat at risk of financial ruin. The other representative body, plus the president, plus the majority of Americans in virtually every poll, oppose these measures and support a more balanced approach. But what can they do about it? Nothing. This is where American Democracy breaks down. I now have a clear first-hand example of the worst possible conduct a Democracy can breed.
Vecchione babbled,
the GOP still holds an edge over Democrats on who are the more wasteful spenders
Bush II racked up more than $6 trillion in debt (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_debt_by_U.S._presidential_terms & their source is CBO) over his 8 years, that is more than 40% of our $14.3 trillion national debt in less than 4% of our nation’s history.
You are an idiot.
And a bigot.
And a liar.
::turns to face the audience::
You see, folks, all Vecchione cares about is whether “his” team wins or not. The rest of the nation can go to hell for all he cares–in fact, as far as he’s concerned, they are already going to hell. It’s just a question of time. The only way his tiny little reptile brain can process the momentous, historic changes engulfing the United States and the world is by shriveling up inside its thick little pea-sized skull and telling him to blame those awful Democrats and those disgusting homosexuals and those degenerate single mother welfare queens for everything that ever went wrong and all the problems facing our nation, facts and history be damned (to the same place as the aforementioned gays and Democrats and single mothers, presumably).
To his mind, he is already “saved” along with all his buddies with the R’s next to their names.
To my mind, he has a lot to learn about the difference between the judgment of man and the judgment of God.
Behavioral bargaining theory — Marginal Revolution // Jul 28, 2011 at 3:18 pm
[...] From David Frum: The big benefit of the Boehner plan is that it is seen to be imposed – and the current GOP mindset is that it’s better to gain less by show of force than to get more by negotiation. [...]